LIVE: American Idol Murder Trial - Day 4 | OH v. Caleb Flynn transcript

Please be seated. Good morning. Uh we are here on case number 26CR 88, state of Ohio versus Caleb C. Flynn. Sir, is that you? >> Yes, sir. >> All right. This matter comes on for its fifth day of trial. Um we are still in the midst of the state's case and chief. Um Mr. Watkins, are we ready to proceed? >> Yes, sir. Okay. Anything any pre-trial matters that the court needs to address? >> Mr. Mulligan. >> No, thank you.

Miss Osenorf, if you'd like to bring in the jewelry. Heat. Ladies and gentlemen of the joy, please have a seat. Welcome back. Let you get acclimated. The court will ask that you turn off your phones completely, both for the jurors as well as those that are in the gallery. Thank you. Um, at this point, Mr. Joseph from the state, would you like to call your next witness? >> Thank you, honor. State calls Detective Brad Klein.

Detective Klein, if you'd like to come up to the witness stand, if you would raise your right hand, Miss Oendorf will swear you in. Do you swear or the testimony you're about to give to this court and this whole >> Mr. Joseph, you may inquire with this witness. Thank you, [clears throat] your honor. Sir, can you please state your name for the record and spell your last name? >> Brad Cole, K L I N. >> And where are you currently employed? >> Tip City Police Department. >> In what capacity? >> I'm a detective for Tip City.

My current assignment is with the DEA as a task force officer. >> And what's the DEA? >> Drug Enforcement Administration. >> How long have you been employed with the Tip City Police Department? >> For eight years. >> Any prior law enforcement experience to that? Yes, I was with the Miami County Sheriff's Department for 18 years prior to that as a deputy and a detective. >> And what are some of your roles as a DA DEA task force member? >> We investigate federal drug crimes, trafficking, drug transportation.

Can you speak on this a little bit, please? >> We we investigate drug traffickers. And uh how long how many years have you been been a police officer? >> 28. >> And where did you receive your training? >> At St. St. Clair Police Academy. >> And any other specialized training you've received as a police officer in the course of your career? >> I've been through numerous trainings on certified evidence technician. I've been went to schooling for criminal uh investigations, interviews, and numerous other things. >> And in the course of your career, have you investigated any burglaries? >> Yes.

Approximately how many? >> In the course of your career, have you seen any uh doors kicked down by law enforcement? >> Yes, I have. >> Approximately how many? I would say probably 30 to 40 at least. >> And were you assigned to investigate incident that occurred on February 16th, 2026 at 9:32 Cunningham Court? >> Yes. >> And did you respond to that scene? >> Yes, I did. >> When did you first arrive on scene? I first arrived on scene probably about a/4 till 4 in the morning. >> And what did you observe at the scene when you first arrived? >> Uh when I first arrived I saw several police cruisers crime crime scene tape up around the residence around the property of the residence and uh several officers. >> And who was there when you first arrived?

Which officers? >> Uh officer Lis, Officer G Papa, and Sergeant Russ Miller. And then what did you do when after you uh first got there? >> Uh I spoke with the officers on the scene, Sergeant Enson, and they advised me that there had been a break in and there was a deceased female in the bedroom. >> And what did you do next? >> Uh met with Detective Sergeant Morgan. Uh we decided to go in and do a walk through of the residence and we went in to the master bedroom.

Only went in about 2 feet, 2 to 3 ft, sorry. Uh I observed a deceased person laying in the bed. They had a towel partially over their head. There was a lot of blood in the facial area and the hand and arm area. >> And where did you go next? Um, from there, uh, when I exited the bedroom, I observed the door was open to the garage. [clears throat] I entered the garage. I observed the, uh, Ford F150 truck and a minivan.

The access door to the outside was open with a refrigerator behind it. >> Um, and what did you observe about uh the the door, the access door that was open? Uh once I walked around the minivan to where I could get up close to the door, I observed that the um door knob had been broken off. It was laying on the concrete garage floor inside of the door frame along along with the uh crown that goes between the door and the door knob and some broken off wood chips.

There was some damage to the frame of the door, but it was on the inside. And based on your observations, uh, is was the what you observed consistent with, uh, past doors that you you've seen broken into? >> No. >> And what made you say that? >> Because of where the debris was, it was all on the inside of the door frame, inside of the garage. >> And what did you do next? >> At that point, we exited the residence. Um, detective Sergeant Morton was calling BCI uh to take care of the crime scene.

From there, I spoke with the next door neighbor, the Bammans. Um, they're at the end of the culdeac. So, if you're facing the Flynn residence, they'd be the house to the left. [clears throat] They had some video footage from the ring camera. I um observed that footage that they had and the only thing that footage showed was law enforcement showing up. >> And what did you do after that? >> From there, we checked with the other neighbors.

Um myself and Officer Linkis went down the east side of the street and checked with neighbors to see if they saw anything or heard anything, if they had any camera footage. Uh we checked Cunningham Court on the east side. checked on Manchester and then we came on the back side of County in court which was St. Leonard and anybody that we spoke to that morning which was around about 4:30ish um nobody had seen anything or heard anything um and nobody had any camera footage besides the big news. >> What did you do after that?

[clears throat] After that, we waited for BCI to come in and do um do their investigation. Um once uh special agent Hammonds was finished marking all of his evidence, he came out and notified us of that. We then went and myself um detective Sergeant Morgan, Detective Bernard went inside the residence. Um he just pointed out the evidence that he had marked and what he was going to collect. At that point we exited so he could collect him and uh another special agent could collect the evidence.

[clears throat] Uh the jury's heard uh testimony about multiple searches that have occurred. Were you involved any in any of the searches uh on the scene? >> Yes. >> And did one of those include the attic? >> Yes. >> Can you tell the jury about that, please? Um, we decided on I want to say it was Thursday that we were going to rent an insulation vacuum and take it insulation out of the attic so we could better search that area.

Uh, the attic had probably 2 to 2 and 1/2 ft of blownin insulation throughout the entire thing. Um, so I went to Vania Reynold, rented a insulation vacuum. We got six 75 cubic square foot bags that would hold the insulation that was vacuumed out. Um myself and some detectives from the sheriff's department went up in the attic was using that to take out as much insulation as we could. Um we may have got half of the insulation out.

Um we searched the best that we could. Um but we were up there. >> When you say you searched the best that you could, what do you mean by that? >> We couldn't search every square inch. There was too much insulation in there and there was areas in which we couldn't get to. >> Can you give an example of one of those areas >> like where the roof line comes down and meets meets the uh rafters, we we couldn't get into there.

There was areas that were maybe to 6 in tall that we couldn't get into and plus with all the insulation there, we couldn't vacuum all the home. >> Were you also involved in searching underneath the shed? >> Yes, I was. and tell the jury about that, please. >> I have had a call from the victims um advising that he would feel more comfortable if we could possibly check underneath of his shed for any possible evidence. So, myself and our chief went out there and we decided that we thought we could lift it we thought we could have it lifted up by the street department with some heavy equipment.

We had the supervisor of the streets department, Tony Hunt, come out. He agreed. He contacted one of his employees, Jeff Burkheart. He brought out a backhoe that had some forks in it. Um, they put that underneath the side of the shed, lifted it up. We put some 6x6 blocks to make it more secure and safe. I got down on my hands and knees, went underneath of the shed to check under there to make sure there was nothing there. >> Did you find anything of evidentary value at that time? >> We did not.

There's been testimony that the FBI canvased and handed out your card to neighbors in the area. Did you receive any uh response from anyone with any tips? >> I received one and it was from I think their name was Brandon Walter. Um they live probably 3 to four blocks away at the corner of Bair and Arapjo. Um, they have some video of the intersection where there's a stop sign. >> And did you learn anything relevant to your investigation based on that tip? >> No, I did not.

And my understanding you were also involved in uh removing a large piece of evidence from the residence. Is that correct? >> Yes. >> Can you tell the jury about that? >> I was taxed with cutting the door and door frame out of the residence where the alleged breakdown occurred. And who'd you do that with? >> Detective Bernard. >> And how did you and Detective Bernard remove the door from the from the residence? >> With a battery powered saw. >> And after removing the door, what how did you what did you do with that?

I placed some uh paper down in the rear of my truck and placed it into the truck and transported that to the tip city police department where I assisted special agent or special agent I'm sorry police specialist Adam and putting it into the evidence locker and or evidence room I'm sorry [clears throat] I approach your >> you Okay. Sir, if you can look behind you, I'm going to reference you as states exhibits 283 and 284.

Do those look familiar to you? >> Yes, they do. And how do you how how do you why do they look familiar to you? Okay. The door and the flashing circuit around the door. Uh, can you please take a look at those? Your honor, permission to step off the stand. >> Detective Pawn, you may proceed. >> Just take a look at it for now. And can you put some gloves on, please? Um, are all the seals intact that you can touch that you can see? >> Yes. >> And how did that how did the door and the trim get off here? >> I transported and transported the door. >> And is the door in the same condition as it was when you transported it? >> Yes, it is.

Can you please open uh both of those when you approach May we approach? >> You miss [clears throat] >> [snorts] >> Heat. Heat. Heat up here. It's going to take a couple minutes to assemble. >> Council, we're just going to go off the record for a couple minutes while they work on that. Just give us the thumbs up when you're ready. >> Thank you. off. Just go for now. Just open. Are you please open? >> You good? >> Yeah. >> All right.

Miss back. >> Just wait. Mike, please. >> All right. back in the record in 26 CR 88. >> Sir, is that door in the same condition as it was uh when you remove it from the house? Other than the portions that Well, is it in the same condition as it was when you removed it from the house? >> And other than the the I guess I'll call it damage that occurred when you removed it, you see anything different about the door as it was prior to removal?

I don't see anything. Your honor, permission for Detective Morgan to help Detective. Detective Morgan, you can assist Detective Klein in assembling this. >> So, Tracy right here. So the picture can see All right. Heat. You have a question. Heat. Heat. Is that secure? >> I'm sorry. Open the other one, too. That's exhibit 284. Any seals broken that you can see or any tape disturbed? No. Heat. Heat. Oh no. Can you please tell the jury what's in that?

Is that a room door? [cough] And is this the trim once you can see it in the same condition as it was when you left on scene? Here's what it is. Heat. Heat. Heat. And Ser, as far as you can tell, uh, in the same condition as it was when you removed on that day >> after you removed it. >> Yes. >> Were you also involved in the collection of an iPad in this case? >> Yes, I was. >> And where was that located? hall that was located in the office area, music room area, uh, and a desk. >> You're on my approach. >> You may show that when this was previous exhibit 280.

Is that your DM? >> Yes. And how is it familiar to you? >> I collected that on Tuesday the 17th. >> How do you know that? >> Because I marked the envelope when I collected it. >> It does appear that the envelope isn't accessed since you submitted. >> Yes. >> Are any seals still intact? >> Yes. You stay What that is? Say Apple iPad. And is that iPad in the same condition as it was when you collected on that day? Yes. Please.

Mhm. This time they would ask that sty is 280 283 and 284 the >> 280. Yes. Okay. The iPad. Um any objection from the defense? >> Uh no. >> The court will admit states exhibit 280. 283 and 284. >> No further questions at this time, your honor. >> Any cross examination, Mr. Morgan? >> Uh, thank you. >> Good morning. >> So, Detective Klein, that um door the way it is configured right now is showing the outside of the door, correct? >> Yes.

And based on your knowledge of how that door works, it opens to the inside. Correct. >> Yes. >> And it can't because of the door frame open to the outside. >> Right. >> So the only way to go through that door is if door opens to the inside, >> right? >> Okay. And uh you indicated that on that particular day, I guess it was rather early in the morning, you started talking to neighbors, correct? >> Yes. >> And the um Mr.

Bingaman, it looks like it's 946 Cunningham Court. Um I'm not real good with north, south, east, or west. That's not my thing. Um, tell me if we are in the um 932 Cunningham, the Flynn's resident, is that the neighbor to the right or the neighbor to the left? >> If you are facing the front of Flint's residence and it's the neighbor to the left. >> So, if you're facing it, so I I was in the Flynn residence, but if you're actually looking at it, it's the neighbor to the left, >> right?

If you're looking at the front of the Flynn's residence, it is the neighbor to the left. >> Okay. And on that particular day, you indicated that you actually watched some of his camera footage. >> Yes. >> Was there a test ever done on the camera to determine how sensitive it is? In other words, how big of an object it would take to trigger the camera? >> Nothing. >> Okay. And on that particular day, 2:30 in the morning, 3:30 in the morning, 4:30 in the morning, when you perhaps talked to him, it was both dark and fog.

Correct. >> I remember it being dark. >> Okay. So, after you talked to the neighbor to the left, what direction did you go in terms of talking to other neighbors? I spoke to the neighbors on the east side of the culde-sac which would have been if you're facing the Clint's house to her right of their house to Manchester and then back around on St. L. >> Okay. And did you look at anyone else's Ring camera footage that was available? >> Nobody had any available. >> Okay.

Did no one have a camera? >> There were several people that had cameras. >> Okay. And did you view what was on and recorded on those cameras to see if they were giving an accurate statement to you as to what was on their cameras? That's on. >> Okay. And so all the people, including the neighbor to the left and the neighbor to the right, indicated they heard nothing on that night. >> I had nobody tell me they heard anything on that night. >> So, and that was for every single person on that street that you were available to talk to.

Correct. >> The people that I spoke with, >> right? And so virtually no one heard anything who was actually the closest to the Flynn residents. >> Nobody heard anything prior to the law enforcement. My dear friend >> Okay. It's my understanding that um on February the 18th um you assisted task force officers um and perhaps perhaps task force officer Farcus with um an X-ray machine. Do you recall that? >> I did not say Mr.

Farcus. I contacted Ohio State Patrol drug interdiction team in Columbus about an X-ray machine. >> Okay. And do you know whether or not the X-ray machine was used on the walls of the Flynn residence to attempt to locate the gun? >> The Ohio State Patrol interdiction team did not respond with their X-ray machine. >> Did they ever respond? >> No. >> Okay. the um shed that you um raised and looked under, whose property was that on if you recall? >> The big one. >> Okay.

And that's the neighbor to the left if you're facing if you're residents. >> Correct. And so the jury and the lawyers and what have you did a jury view at the very first day of this uh case. Um there appeared to be a couple of sheds in the backyard. One I recall was sort of beige and the other one was sort of blue. Do you remember which one of those was raised? >> It was the ship between the big moon's residence and the FL residence. the blue one.

I do not republic. >> Okay. >> And so, but you know it was on the Bingaman's property. And did you were you aware of a shed that was to the right of the one that was lifted? >> There was a shed on Flint property, >> right? Was that one lifted? >> That was not okay. Because of the various search warrants that were signed and authorized, you guys did have the authority to raise that if you wanted to. Correct. >> That's that was not my decision. >> Well, I didn't ask if it was your decision, but you had the authority to do it. >> I would assume so.

And at a minimum, whether you had the authority or not, there was no one there to tell you no. >> Correct. >> No, there was not. >> Certainly. Were you involved in the um arrest of Mr. Flint? >> I was there when he was arrested. >> Uh my understanding is on that particular day he was uh interviewed. He voluntarily showed up for an interview and that interview was um completed um I believe by Detective Lord. Detective Lower and Sergeant Detective. >> Okay.

And um he was uh were you the officer after that when he was walking around in the parking lot um that asked him to come back into the police station? >> Either myself or Sergeant Detective Morgan asked him to return to the lobby of the police station. who um who decided that it was okay for him to leave and walk around in the parking lot? >> I do not not answer that question. >> And who uh decided that um he was to come back into the U police station? >> Prosecutor Watkins. >> Okay.

And um it's my understanding that um Prosec Peter Watkins was the person who ordered the arrest in this case. Correct. >> Okay. But we know that the in the volunteer interview was completed and he was walking out around in the parking lot. Correct. >> He was walking out to his vehicle. Yes. >> Okay. And free to leave >> at that time. Um, I don't have anything further. Thank you. >> Thank you, Mr. Mulling. Any redirect? >> No, your honor. >> All right, Detective Klein, you may step down.

Is he released from the defense subpoena? >> All right, you're excused. >> Okay, give me a second. The state would just give the court a second. >> Good. Um, Miss Rette from the state, would you like to call your next witness? >> Yes, your honor. The state will call Lieutenant Jason Moore. Lieutenant Moore, if you'd like to come up to the witness stand. Once there, would you turn and raise your right hand? Miss Odenorf will swear you in.

Please swear or affirm that the testimony you're about to speak to this jury will be nothing but the truth that help. Yes, I do. >> Thank you. Please have a seat. >> Mrs. Arnett, would you like to inquire with this witness? >> Yes. Thank you. Lieutenant Moore, could you please state and spell your full name for the record? >> Jason Moore. J A S O N M O P O R E. >> Where are you currently employed? >> Miami County Sheriff's Office. >> What is your current position and rank there? >> I'm a lieutenant.

I'm in charge of the detective section. >> The entire detective section? >> Yes. >> And how long have you been employed with the sheriff's office? Uh >> almost 29 years. >> How long have you been serving as a detective for the sheriff's office? almost 24 years. >> And how long have you been the lieutenant? >> 10 years. >> Can you briefly describe your duties as the lieutenant of the detective section? >> Sure. Um, so my job is to supervise uh all of our uh detectives that we have in the section.

I also participate in most of their cases. Uh working uh my own cases as well, responding to uh call outs, uh major investigations, things of that nature. Have you received specialized training in crime scene investigation, evidence collection? >> Yes. So through my law enforcement experience, um we receive continuing education and training throughout my career um involving um being certified as an evidence technician, uh um homicide investigations, major crime investigations, uh search warrant writing training, um multiple sources for interview interrogation, undercover drug investigations, um child death investigations, uh forensic pathology investigations, Um also um a lot of SWAT tactical training.

So that's continuing education throughout my career. >> Throughout your career, how many violent crimes have you investigated? >> Oh, um over 20 homicides, um violent sexual assaults, um aggravated assaults, uh many of those >> burglaries. >> Yes. Detective or Lieutenant Moore, uh, I'd like to direct your attention to February 16th or 17th, 2026. Do you recall that day? >> Yes. >> And did you receive a request from the Tip City Police Department that day? >> Yes. >> What was the request for? >> Uh, it was the morning of the 17th around 9:00 a.m.

I got a phone call from Captain Tony Smith from the Tip City Police Department. Um, I had been aware that the Tip City Police Department had been investigating a homicide that occurred the prior day and Captain Smith requested uh the sheriff's office assistance with that investigation. >> Did you respond to this request? >> Yes, myself, uh, three of my detectives and Chief Deputy Lore responded down to the Tip City Police Department later that day. >> When you responded to the police department, who was present? uh Tiffany detectives, uh Captain Smith, um there was a BCI investigator there and uh my detectives and chief deputy. >> And what happened when you were there? >> Our initial arrival, we received a briefing um based on the facts that were known at the time.

And I also learned that Tip City Police Department had requested the assistance of the Dayton FBI office to assist and they were going to be providing some additional manpower. Did you ultimately respond to the residence of 932 Cunningham Court? >> Yes, later that afternoon. >> When you arrived, who was on scene? >> Upon my arrival, uh there was a Tiffany police officer there, a maintained security at the scene. Uh crime scene tape was still there.

Um there was a canine unit that was there. I believe it was an ATF K9 that was doing a search at the exterior and curlage of the property. Um, and as uh I was there, our detectives, my detectives were there and then um FBI agents and task force members periodically showed up. >> What was the purpose of your assistance? Your yours and your detectives? >> Mine and my detectives, we were assigned to conduct an interior search of the residence at 932 Cunningham.

Um, on that day, >> what were you specifically assigned to? I was assigned to an area that's uh the attached garage on on the property, the interior of that. >> And you stated it was to search the property. What were you searching for? >> Based on our briefing, um it was reported that um firearm was obviously used in the crime and that firearm had not been recovered yet. So that was my initial um cause and uh reason for the search. >> And so you began your search in the attached garage.

That's correct. >> Correct. Who all was in there when you were searching the garage? >> Uh myself, um Detective Elsas, Detective McMack and they're both detectives with the sheriff's office. Um at least two uh FBI agents or task force members. I'm not exactly sure. There's four or five of us. >> And over your with your time on scene, can you walk the jury through what you searched in the garage? >> Certainly. So, um, as I went into the garage from the interior of the house, uh, there's a pedestrian door that goes into the garage, um, that immediately opens up into, um, the south wall.

Um, facing uh, the overhead garage doors would have been in front of me. uh to the to the north or to the right. Uh there's a hole or a a wall and there was an exterior pedestrian door that leads to the outside on the north side of the wall north side of the garage. There were two vehicles also inside the garage, a truck and a minivan. The truck was more by the pedestrian door walking into the garage and the van would have been to the north of that. >> What was between the truck and the minivan? >> Uh there were items, household items.

There were some toys, I believe, some maybe some garden equipment, a snowblower, I believe. >> And did you search those items? >> Yes. Yes. >> Can you describe how you search those? >> So, I began the search from the door on the entrance. So, on the left wall, the south wall, there was some shoes. There was some shelving units with some boxes of household items. All those things were searched. Boxes were opened very thoroughly.

Um, from that point went around the back of the truck and then worked my way down through the middle between the two cars and all those areas were searched. Uh, the u there was some child's toys there. Those were searched thoroughly. The snowblower was searched, lifted up, turned around. All those areas were searched very thoroughly and then worked my way back around to the north wall. >> And what was on the north wall? >> Again, there's some shelving units.

Um they had um boxes of stored items, just normal garage things that were there. >> You searched those thoroughly? >> Yes. >> What did you observe next? >> As I completed my search, um I ended up at the pedestrian door that leads to the exterior to lead outside. Um, when I was there, the door was open and uh, inside the garage there was a full-size refrigerator that was kind of at an angle, the same angle as the door.

Um, during the briefing, I had learned that that was the um, uh, suspected entry point of an intruder. So, I wanted to view that for myself to see if there was any additional evidence that I may want to search for. What did you observe? >> Uh, from the interior, I observed um the door jamb on the inside had some damage to it. Appeared fresh to me. Um, the door handle on the inside was intact. I could tell that the dead bolt was not engaged at the time.

The mechanism was in the door. I didn't see any damage on the deadbolt. I also didn't see any damage on the the doorork knob latch on the inside. Um, I exited the garage and viewed it from the outside. Um, in doing so, I didn't see any damage, um, significant damage at all to the actual door itself on the exterior. I did notice that the the door handle, the door knob, uh, was not there. Um, I saw no other damage on the the frame or the weather stripping on the outside that the door shuts up against to.

I didn't see any damage there either. >> What stood out about that to you? >> It wasn't what I would expect to see on a forced entry type of a scenario. Um, I would expect to see some sort of marks or damage to the door itself. Um, also if there was any kind of prying or um force used by anything, a tool or anything, I would think I would see some sort of marks. I would also think I would see some damage that wasn't consistent.

Um the damage that I saw on the inside of the door frame wasn't consistent what I would see if the door was locked. I also thought it was um odd and strange that um the removal of the door handle uh whether the door was locked or unlocked, how that would benefit an intruder, it would still make it difficult to open the door. It wasn't what I would normally anticipate to see in a forced entry scenario. >> Detective Morgan or more behind you.

Could you look behind you? >> Sorry. >> Do you recognize that? >> Yes. >> What is that? >> That is the uh door that I was just speaking about. It was removed from the residence. >> And your honor, may I approach? >> You may. >> Could you please put those on? Sure. Can ladies and gentlemen of the jury see? >> I'm going to ask them. >> Okay. >> Could you move the door up here closer to the jury? >> It is on. >> Yeah. Yes.

Uh, Detective Moore, you can step over here. Who's in it? Is this door in the same condition as we observed it on February 17th, 2026? >> Yes, but it's not attached to the house. It's down here. So, yeah, that's the only difference. >> And what is this on the door if you're aware >> with what >> the powder on the door? >> Uh, I believe that's fingerprint dust. >> Is that Was that there when you observed it? >> Yes. >> Okay.

Uh, are you able to open this door >> from the other side? From >> the other side. >> Thank you. Uh, when this door is open, what do you observe damage wise that you previously discussed? Um, again, as I talked about the jam here and the weather stripping, I I don't see any marks, any tool marks or any scrapes. Same thing with this trim. Um, if the door would have been forced up here, you anticipate to see those things. >> And when you shut the door, >> what do you observe?

Again, the door knob is missing and uh no substantial damage at all in this area and you cannot see the damage on the inside of the door hand while the doors closed, which tells me that the door will need to be open for that damage to occur. >> Can you open the door with the door handle missing? No, not as it is. >> Thank you. >> Where do you want the door? >> You want the door over over there? You want it back over here? >> Well, is defense.

Are you done with your questioning? >> I'm not done with my questioning, your honor. No. >> Okay. Um, >> but I'm jealous. >> You have a big exhibit. Then if you wouldn't mind moving it to the right. >> Thank you, Lieutenant Mo. You can take your gloves off. We're done think of it. Lieutenant Moore, after you searched the garage and observed the door, what did you do next? >> Um, at that point um I was uh complete with my searching of the garage.

So, I went inside to see if the other um investigators needed any assistance in searching inside the house. Who was searching inside the house when you went inside? >> Uh, multiple people. There were FBI agents, task force members. Um, uh, some of my detectives were in inside at that point as well. >> And what were you searching? >> Um, most of what I did at that after that was I searched uh the vents in the floor of the residence.

Um I know from experience that sometimes in cases uh a lot of times narcotics cases to be honest um items can be hidden within vents. Um vent covers can be removed fairly easily. So I went around and I checked all those in the in the residence. >> Did you locate anything? >> I did not. >> What did you search next? >> Um in the living room area there's a fireplace uh with like a mantle. um that's covered like with shiplap and a TV mounted.

So I searched in behind those in behind the TV, in behind the the fireplace and checked all the shiplap to make sure that it was secure. There weren't any hidden compartments or anything of that nature. So I just was thorough. >> Did you locate anything of evidence? >> I did not. >> Did you search anything else in the inside of the house? >> I did not. And again, how many people were searching inside the house at that time? >> I can't be 100% certain.

There was at least 10 people inside. >> Where were they searching? >> Everywhere else. Bedroom, uh, living room, there was a an office type area, uh, the children's bedrooms, the playroom, any every place. When you were in the garage, can you describe how it was getting around the garage? >> What do you mean by that? >> Were the two cars still in the garage at the time you were in there? You stated that previously? >> Yes. >> How was it walking around the garage?

Were you able to do so easily? Can you explain how it was walking around the garage? So it uh moving towards uh the west or along the south wall where I first um began searching was fairly simple. There was plenty of room in between for me to go to turn right or north and go in front of the vehicle. The truck that was there. There was a large looked like a piece of styrofoam that was long like maybe a bed something to go on a bed mattress.

Um, and it was difficult to get in between that styrofoam and the front of the truck. I had to turn sideways to get through there. Same thing with walking around the front of the van where the refrigerator was and the door was. I couldn't get through there. I had to go walk around the back to get through without disturbing anything. I didn't want to do that. So, I walked around the back. On that date, February 17th, did you search anywhere else other than the interior of the residence and the garage? >> No.

Uh cursory work walk of the yard, um the exterior and the backyard. That was all that I did that day. >> Did you respond again for additional searches? >> Yes, multiple times. >> And can you briefly describe those searches for the jury, please? >> Sure. Um on uh February 19th, um myself and several other detectives responded back uh to 932 Cunningham. Um two detectives were assigned to collect some items within the house, I believe some tools, and while they did that, I extended my search outside.

Um I know other agents had searched these areas, but I wanted to be thorough again. So, um, in the backyard there's, um, on the north end of the property, there's like a landscape wall with some flowers and a little bit of a tree line that led to a grassy area and there were some sticks and some debris. So, I personally searched all those areas, removed leaves. It was February, so it was still pretty wet and all the leaves were still on the ground.

So, removed all those. Uh there was two pile of sticks, large piles of sticks that was removed and um the area under that was searched. There were several rocks that were movable. So I remove those, move those stacks of bricks that were moved. This as thorough as I could possibly be in case something had been discarded there. >> And you stated you responded several times to do searches outside of the property. Is that correct?

[snorts] >> Yes. >> What did you do on the additional times? Well, on the 19th again, as I searched um the curlage there on the backside, the north side of the property, um Detective Shell, once he was done um inside the residence, I requested that he respond, help me search a field area on the north end of the property, which uh had not been searched to my knowledge. I know a canine had been used to search the area.

So, um, him and I, Detective Shell and I, we're about 8 ft apart and we went to the east side of, um, the defendant's property and walked north to a tree line which is several hundred yards away and then turned around and came back and we did basically a linear grid search down and back down and back all the way to the west to additional tree line that butts up against the bike path that leads north. >> Did you locate anything of evidentiary value then? >> No.

On the 19th, did you consider continue any s other searches? >> No, that was it that day. >> And you responded again, you said? >> Yes. >> When was that? >> On the 20th, the next day. >> What did you do then? >> Uh the 20th um we had um obtained tools to use and additional search, which would have been metal detectors. I believe we had two metal detectors that were provided to us. We also had large um article magnets.

Um, we also I brought from the sheriff's office, I call it a bore camera, which is a a skinny wire with a camera and a light on the end of it. En that enables you to get into areas, holes, or areas that you wouldn't normally be able to see with the human eye. So, those items were used uh in a grid search in the backyard uh extended to that landscape area that I talked about and also a grassy area before that field. Ground hog poles were looked into with the bore camera.

Um I believe the detective from Tip City that day also used the magnets in several um of the the sewer drains on that on Cunningham Court and also the adjacent streets. >> Did you participate in in anything else on the 20th? >> No. >> Was that the last of your searches for the property? >> No. >> You did. Could you tell the jury about your additional searches? I believe it was February 25th. Um, we were requested by the Tip City Police Department to conduct an additional search and detectives from the Pickle Police Department, the Troy Police Department, from the Sheriff's Office, and the Tip City Police Department all responded.

Um, and we were requested to do a grid search in a an area that was northwest of the crime scene that extended all the way to I75 north to uh, Kester Kohl'sville close to where the high school was, which was a very large area. It's mostly wooded with a little bit of grassy area and contains the bike path and the left side of that or the west side of that and the east side of the bike path. >> Did you locate anything?

Did anyone during that search locate anything of evidentiary value? >> No. >> Was that the last of your searches of the property? >> No. >> Could you tell the jury about additional searches? >> There was an additional search, I believe, in the beginning of March. I don't recall the specific date. Um, again, we were requested by the Tip City Police Department to go out and conduct an additional grid search. Um, this time we were going to um be as thorough as we possibly could.

So we had about 15 people again, the same detectives, Federal Police Department, Detroit Police Department, Sheriff's Office, and we were uh shoulder-to-shoulder um and set up a uh basically a skirmish line. And we walked um from the bike path through a fence fence line and a tree line um searching everything. Um, and we got done, turn around, went back, and then we would move down, go through, turn around, go back through the same area we just went through.

We would move down and do the same thing. We did that a couple hundred yards down into the field area. >> Was that the last of your searches of the property? >> That was the last that I was involved with. Yes. >> Approximately how many hours would you say you and your team spent searching this property in the surrounding area? I would I would estimate 15 hours at least. >> Did you have any Did you assist in any other work on this case? >> Yes.

Yes. So on uh February 18th uh the second day of our involvement with the sheriff's office um when I responded to the Tip City Police Department that morning to do whatever was needed, I was requested to search or visit uh a local gun range. And um the purpose of that was there was a firearm that was reported missing from the property um the defendant's house and the defendant's gun. Um, I was under the impression, I was told, I learned that we did not have the mag, model, or serial number of that gun, the defendant couldn't provide that information.

So, the gun was missing and we needed to find identifiable um information about that gun so that we could enter it into a law enforcement database as as stolen, potentially being used in a homicide. So, in an effort to try to find that information, um, I went to Bandalia Range in Armory. uh they uh are a retail store that sells firearms, ammunition, and also they have an indoor range. So, I responded to that location.

It's in Mandelia. Um and asked if uh spoke to management and asked if they could look into their records to see if um Caleb Flynn or Ashley Flynn had purchased any firearms there, ammunition, or any range time. >> And what did you become what did you learn during that search? They could provide no information that that ever occurred. >> Lieutenant Moore, are you a member of the SWAT or tactical team? >> Yes. >> Can you What does that mean? >> Um, so the sheriff's office has a tactical team.

Um, it's commonly known as a SWAT team. Our our team is called the special response team, SRT. >> What's your position there? Uh my position right now is that I'm the commander of the team. >> How long have you been the SWAT commander? >> 10 years. >> What does it mean to be the commander? >> It means I run the team. Uh take care of training. Um take care of any assets we may need, tools, and uh lead the team. >> Tactical decisions. >> How long have you been involved on the SWAT team? >> Uh I've been on the team for 25 years.

In your role as a SWAT member, SWAT commander, have you had to force open doors? >> Many? >> Approximately how many times have you forced open doors in your career? >> Well, with my work with the SWAT team, um, also as a detective and executing m many search warrants over the years, uh, hundreds of doors, both interior and and exterior doors. When you examined this door, the door behind you, the door at 932 Cunningham Court, did you see damage consistent with forcible entry in your experience? >> No, this I did not see anything that I would expect to see, >> which would be what?

Uh damage, as I said before, damage um on the door itself, be it from a a shoe, a boot, a knee, an elbow, uh some sort of a mark or a dent, and also damage to part of, if not all of the door jamb inside and out. >> And did you see any of that damage here? >> No, not consistent with my explanation. No. >> Thank you. One moment, your honor. Certainly. >> I have no further questions at this time for this switch, your honor. >> Thank you, Mr. >> Best Council.

Uh, can you explain to me through your training and experience why so many searches took place? Well, based on my training experience, if uh at first you don't succeed, you try and try again, right? So, if uh we search um at first in the residence, if you don't find what you're looking for, you expand that. So, um based on what I was told that there was an intruder that had fled the scene. So, that means that could be any direction at any time, right? seller, we have to expand our search for all possibilities until we exhausted all our efforts. >> Okay.

So, after expanding outside of the residence, you conducted several grid searches of the area, correct? >> And you described those during direct examination from your testimony. Why conduct so many searches of the same area outside of the residence? >> To be thorough. >> Okay. So, is it that there weren't enough officers the first time? Is it that there wasn't enough thoroughess the first time? What is it in your opinion that led to the multiple searches? >> I didn't make that decision.

I was asked to to assist and of course we're going to assist. So my opinion, if that's what you're asking me is um the initial large grid search um we had about 15 officers, but it was a larger area that we covered. And to whittle that down and to be more thorough, the last search that we did, which would I would call it a good search as well, was uh more narrowed and closer to the bike path, which would have been a potential escape route for an intruder. >> Okay.

So the search in its or the multiple searches through the course of the investigation began in the residence, expanded to the exterior of the residence and the surrounding area and then narrowed again to the area of the bike path. Is that what your testimony is? >> That's how it occurred. Yes. Were there any other searches that occurred to your knowledge or that you were aware of uh that you were involved in that occurred outside of the neighborhood? >> I'm aware there was some canvasing that that had taken place.

I wasn't involved in any of that though. >> What was the canvasing? I believe um FBI task force members had knocked on doors uh canvasing the neighborhood to see if there was any witnesses to anything. Also checking for uh video footage, but again I wasn't involved in any of that. >> But that was still in the neighborhood surrounding Cunningham Court. >> I believe so. Yes. >> Were there any other residences or any other areas outside of that neighborhood that were searched? >> Not to my knowledge.

I'll know what you're on. >> Mhm. Certainly. >> Can you tell me where that bike path starts and ends? >> Um, generally I can. Um, so the culde-sac that 932 Cunningham Court sits on, to the west of that is another culde-sac. Uh the bike path starts there um and extends north and as far as I know it goes to Kesler Kohl'sville where it goes beyond that I don't know and that's kind of dead ends into where the high school is. >> Okay.

And about how long is the path from the area where the culde-sac one over starts and the school >> quarter mile half mile best guess. Were there any cameras searched where the bike path ends? >> I don't know that there are cameras in that area. >> Were did you know of any searches where police looked for any cameras involved? >> I wasn't involved in any of them. >> I have no other questions at this time. >> Any redirect from the state? >> No, your honor. >> Thank you.

Lieutenant Moore, you may step down. Lieutenant >> and you're excused. Would the state like to call their next witness? >> Thank you, honor. Call Detective Zack Farcus. >> Detective Varcus, if you'd like to come up to the witness stand. If you would turn and raise your right hand, Miss Oendorf, swear you in. Yes, ma'am. >> Mr. Watkins, would you like to inquire with this witness? >> Thanks, honor. Could you please state your full name and spell it for the record? >> Yes.

Zachary Farcus. Z A C H A R Y. Farcus. F A R K A S. And where are you employed, sir? >> I'm employed with the City of Dayton Police Department and I am a full-time task force member with the FBI's uh safe street task force. >> What is a task force officer? Uh task force officer um is a individual from a local police department that assists um either the FBI, DEA um in investigations basically to up their numbers uh and assist investigations. >> And what's the safe streets task force with the FBI?

Uh the primary purpose of safe streets is to focus in on violent crimes in the southern district of Ohio, whether it's homicide, cold case, uh drugs, guns, or anything like that. >> What part of the state is that does that encompass? Is that I7 south? >> Yeah. So, it's Yeah. So, it's going to be I7 south uh heading down into Cincinnati and then goes over towards Columbus and then back down that other section of the state. in major cases in part of that state or in that part of the state.

You're often involved. >> Yes. >> How long have you been employed as a TFO with the FBI? Dayton. >> So, I'm sorry. I've been with the the FBI approximately 18 months now. >> And before that position, what was your law enforcement experience? >> So, I started with the Dayton Police Department as a street crew in 2008. Um, from there I moved to financial crimes as an investigator. Then, and sexual assault. I spent eight years as a active homicide investigator and the last two with a focus on cold case homicides and sexual assaults. >> Have you received specialized training in homicide investigations? >> So yes, uh in 201 13 um I attended Louisville's uh homicide course or homicide investigative course.

It's a twoe program. What training have you received in crime scene processing and evidence collection? uh outside of the standard um so every law enforcement officer in the state of Ohio has to go through a which is the Ohio Police Officer Training Academy and we receive I believe it's a very minimal amount of um true um evidence collection but we received the the basic um knowledge to um locate and obtain evidence.

Detective Park, I'd like to direct your attention to February 17th of 2026. Were you contacted regarding a homicide that day? >> Yes, I was. >> Who contacted you? >> So, I was contacted by Agent Sarah Demer from the FBI. Uh, she requested that I respond to 932 Cunningham Court to assist in an ongoing investigation. >> And what police department were you to assist? >> Uh, the Tip City Police Department in Miami County, Ohio.

[clears throat] What did you observe when you arrived at 932 Cunningham Court? >> So, when I arrived on scene, I observed crime scene tape wrapped around the perimeter of 932 Cunningham Court. Uh there was a marked tip city police cruiser um outside the front of that location and there were I believe anywhere from 10 to 15 um individuals out front um waiting to conduct a search inside the residence. Who did you contact when you arrived on scene? >> I made contact with agent de um at that location. >> And what did you learn about how entry was allegedly made into the residence? >> So what I was told was that entry had been made through the main door in the garage which is on the north side of the residence. >> So who had already processed the scene? >> Say that again. >> Who had already processed the scene? >> So at that point I was told that Ohio's Bureau of Criminal Investigation had been out scene on February 16th. to the day prior and had processed that location and collected evidence. >> Did you examine that side garage door on the north side of the home you just mentioned? >> Yeah.

So once I made entry into the residence um I was told that the uh path that the individual had taken upon making entry again was through that man door through the garage and then into the residence itself. So, I walked through the the residence um and into the garage and looked at the the door itself. Um at that point, I was in the garage. >> What did you obser observe near the door inside the garage? >> So, when looking at the the door, the door itself swung towards the inside of the garage.

It was right hung which means that the um oh I messed up the actual terminology but where the the screws and the where the door actually hangs is on the right hand side the hinges. >> The hinges. Thank you. That's the word I'm looking for. Um and that there was a fridge that was directly in front of um the door itself. I noted that the door had a the door handle itself had a button lock and then above the the locking mechanism was a deadbolt.

At that point, um upon speaking to investigators, not only from the FBI, but also people that had been at the scene the day before, we were told that the Deadpool itself had been unlocked or was contained put inside the door. And the damage I observed was um on the inside frame of the door where the deadbolts locking mechanism would have locked into. How many pry marks did you see on the door itself? I don't know if I I don't know if I can give an exact number of prime marks. >> Did you see any prim marks on the frame of the door? >> We observed damage on the door.

I I don't necessarily know if I would describe them as primarks. >> When you say door, do you mean the door or the door frame? >> The door frame itself. Yes. >> How much what did you see in the way of damage to the actual door itself? So, the only damage that I noted on the door was that the outside handle was no longer on the door frame, and we were told that it had either been struck off, knocked off, or pried off.

Uh, but there was no actual prime marks or physical damage on the door itself. >> When you saw that door not missing, did you move to the exterior of the residence? >> Yes, I did. >> And what did you do at that time? So at that point uh we close the door and in looking at the actual door itself, we do not observe any type of damage whatsoever to the door or to the outside door frame. Based upon your 18 years of law enforcement experience, how was the damage you observed consistent with the door being kicked or forced open? >> It was not.

Um, typically when you'd see a door being kicked open, um, it's almost on the inside of the garage almost looks I don't necessarily say explosion, but it almost looks like an explosion where you have wood chips and other pieces like that that go flying just from the that concussion. From a pry, it's you have marks on the door of the tool that's basically being used to push up against the door and then pry that door open um as points of contact.

And again, we don't see I do not observe any of that at the scene. Would you call those corresponding tool marks? I tool marks on the door and tool marks on the frame in the same spot. >> Yes, that's correct. How many doors have you uh seen have been kicked or pried open in your career? >> Uh a conservative number would be probably over 600. >> And how many have you actually picked yourself? >> Again, conservatively probably over 100 doors of either being kicked in or forced in um either from a street level or as a SWAT officer within the squad. >> After you examine the alleged entry point, what you do next?

Uh at that point I assisted in searching the uh garage. Um inside the garage were two vehicles. One was a Ford F-150 and the other was a minivan Chrysler Town Country. If I'm standing um on the driveway looking at the residence, the Ford F-150 is on the right hand side and the minivan is on the left. I searched both the minivan and the F-150 along with the garage. Um, and nothing of note was located. >> Register to search next. >> Uh, from there I moved inside the residence and searched the kitchen area.

The only thing that we noted in the kitchen was that we saw a bottle of Nyquil um, and some over the counter sleeping medication. >> Is that melatonin? >> I believe it was. Um, I've been told by investigators that the family >> as to what he was told >> sustained. >> Um, after searching the kitchen, um, I then searched one of the closets in the hallway in between where the little girl's bedroom and home was. And again, nothing of note was located. >> What did you search next?

Uh so from there I went out to my vehicle and obtained my metal detector and then checked the uh attic prior to using the metal detector in the attic. >> Where did you access the attic? >> So the attic access was in the garage. There was a pull down and then steps going up into the attic itself. Um, what we were looking for primarily at that point was we were looking for the firearm that was used, but we were also looking for anything that was disturbed up in the attic insulation or anything like that.

Um, again, we were told that the scene had been processed that they were >> sustained. How search? >> So, with the metal detector, we then swept the attic uh looking for uh the firearm. believe we got between 60 to 70% of the attic search with metal checker. Again, nothing located. >> Why could you only search approximately 60 to 70% of the attic? >> So, just because of the the way the house is designed and the the peers basically prevented us from like getting into certain areas of the the roof line or where the insulation is located.

Throughout this investigation, did you work with multiple law enforcement agencies? >> Yes, we did. >> Which agencies were involved? >> Uh, so I have direct knowledge that we worked with the Tip City Police Department, the Miami County Sheriff's Department, FBI, ATF, uh, Dayton Police Department, um, Marine, Montgomery County Sheriff's Department, I believe that's why that was. I'm sure there was probably addition on that. >> And how was the regular communication amongst those agencies? >> So the tips police department did a very good job of having a structured setup.

Uh Captain Tony Smith basically from Tips City Police Department ran um and coordinated all the um pieces of of the pie. I guess the best way to put it uh from the police department and we would meet up on a daily basis um and kind of brief of what and like what we were doing and what we're trying to achieve. >> How did you share information and leads? >> Uh so again that was all passed on to the tip city police department either through their detectives or through county. >> How were tips handled? >> So tips were turned into the tip city police department.

Um I started reviewing the tips on Wednesday morning. Um and the tips were provided to me from the tip city police department. >> How did you ensure each and every tip was appropriately addressed? >> So when we received the tip uh we reviewed what it was. Uh we then assessed whether the information that was provided in the tip had a direct connection to what we were currently investigating. uh if it didn't have what at that time was a direct connection, we kept obviously the tip and um turn it back over to Tip City Police Department not to get rid of.

But if at a certain point or a later point we had to go back to that, we still had that tip. What we were focusing in on at that point when we did have information or tips that at the point of that investigation were relevant to the investigation. >> Approximately, how many tips did you receive? probably between 10 to 15 would be my guess. >> What did you do with all those tips? >> So again, the tips that we um received were followed up on either by myself or by other individuals um associated with that investigation. >> What' you do in the farm field north of the residence? >> So on trying to think what day we're on, Tuesday, Wednesday. of Wednesday.

Um I again reached out to the ATF um and he brought up his um K9 partner who is trained to search for firearms, ballistics, any type of explosive material. And we also use metal detectors and swept the farm field looking for a possible firearm that may have been discarded at that location. Were >> you successful? We were not found. >> On February 19th, did you search 935 St. Leonard's Lane? So, yeah. So, that location, um, so we went back out.

We did another sweep in the area and sweeping the area again. Um, I noted that the back window of the 9:15 >> 9:35 >> 935 St. um was open. This residence is directly behind the Cunningham Court address. Um, checking that area, we noted that there was a for sale sign in the backyard by from Miss C. Graves. We reached out Miss Craves. >> Miss Craves was the realtor for that property, which we later learned was the new occupant for that residence. >> How'd you make contact with her? >> So, we made telephone contacts with her. she was able to send out a representative to that residence.

We were permitted entry into the residence um after explaining to her that we've got an open window. Upon checking the residence, we noted there were still some very high valued items inside the residence, a TV. We noted the gun safe. We also learned that um Miss Graves had um just purchased the property, was preparing to move in, and that she also had a painting crew that had been in there the week before, and that they believe that the painting crew may have left the window open uh to air out the house.

We checked the area where this window was partially open, looking for any type of mud, grass, debris, anything like that, where somebody could have made entry, and we did not observe anything. On February 20th, 2026, did you respond with Agent Dean to locate Falia Botner? >> Yes, we did. Um, we were able to locate Miss Botner at her mom's house on Curry Branch. As we sit here right now, I can't remember the exact address.

I believe it was either the 1600 or 1700 block of Curry Branch. Um, I think Where's Curry Branch? Curry Branch is located in Tip City, right off of Route 25A. Is that uh north or south of 571? >> Uh it's going to be south of 571. >> Were you able to locate her there? >> Yes, sir. >> Where did you transport her? >> Uh so from there, um Agent Demer and I transported Miss Bner and her sister to the Tip City Police Department to get the conduct interview with her.

When did you conduct a follow-up interview with Aaliyah Bachner? Uh the follow-up interview with Miss Bner would have been I believe a couple of weeks um after that. And who is present for that interview? >> Uh her attorney Nick Canary and myself along with agent. Did you conduct a canvas of the neighborhood where Aaliyah Botner stated she stayed the night of the homicide? >> Yes. So during the course of the interview with most Balker, we had learned that she had stayed at her pastor's house was um housesitting.

She was staying at 1518 Hurst Avenue. I responded out to that location and found cameras uh that were located at 1521 Hurst Avenue or Hurst Street. Um that >> Where is Where is Hurst Street located? >> So that's in Vanelia, Ohio. Um I I couldn't tell you what the street is that comes off of first. I know it's over by where the Vandelia Rec Center is in that general location in Montgomery County. And when you located residences with cameras, what did you do? >> Uh made contacts and then um in this particular uh incident, we were able to get uh videos from the residents at 1521 and he was able to provide me with um three videos um off his brain camera system that's set up on the top of his garage.

Where is 1521 Hurst Street in relation to the home where Leo was staying that night? It's directly across the street. >> And what did you observe in the three videos? >> So in the the first video, we have Alia's vehicle, which is a 2009 white Jeep, leaving the driveway right in the area of I believe it's like 6:30 to 7:30 p.m. >> This is on February 15. >> This is on February 15th. I apologize. Yes. And then on February 16th, we have her vehicle returning back to that location at just after midnight on February 16th.

We then have her vehicle then the vehicle when it pulls into that residence pulls directly into the garage. Um, and then it appears that the garage door closes. The other video that we have is from just after I believe 10:00 a.m. on February 16th. We have her vehicle leaving the garage and then driving um out of the driveway out towards where the main drive is to come and go from that plant. >> What other videos were present from that neighbor's home at 1521 during that time period?

So, we were able to see that there was additional video um of cars driving by the house or individuals um walking by that activated the camera, but at no point did we see Miss Botner's vehicle leaving that residence? >> And how was that information you discovered consistent with what Miss Botner told you during that interview? >> It was consistent with the time frames that Miss Botner had provided to us on when she had come and gone from that residence.

I have John. >> You're back. >> How many of the tips uh that you received and tracked down had uh any evidentary value? >> Uh one. Which one's that? Uh we've gotten a tip from a Karen Jess who is the aunt of um Ashley Flynn um that had requested um to speak with us in reference to her homicide. >> And where did that tip lead you? >> So that tip led us to two of the um friends of Ashley that we were able to do interviews with.

After you spoke to them, where did you go? >> At that point, we went in and tracked down this um to speak with her. >> And all this was on February 20th, 2026. >> Uh between the same date as the interview of Aaliyah. >> No, I think it was I think it was the date of four. Is there something that would um refresh your recollection? I my report would probably help. Um yeah, if I refer back to the report, >> you may Heat.

Heat. You prepared a uh report on this matt and this man uh sorry this investigation. Yes. I don't want you to read from I'm just doing this to refresh your Okay. >> I'm going to direct your attention to the bottom of page five of your report on page. Review that. And once you've reviewed it, if you could let me know, I'll take it back from you. Thank you. When uh did you interview the friends of Ashley? >> So they interviewed the friends that we interviewed the friends on the 20th >> and that's when you became aware of Miss Bodner.

Uh, we became aware of Miss B on the 19th when we spoke with Miss Jess. >> That's all the questions I had. >> Thank you. Any cross-examination of this witness? >> Smith. >> Good morning, Detective. >> Across your career, approximately how many homicides and burglaries have you investigated? I realize it's probably a big number. >> Uh, a conservative number would probably be over 300. >> And just to review a little bit, you had reviewed the tips that came in from TIP City.

Correct. >> That is correct. Yes. Was it your role in um reviewing the tips and then deciphering whether or not they were reasonable leads to continue investigating? >> Yes. >> And what sort of information did you utilize or what sort of um opinions did you use through your training and experience in order to uh filter valid tips from invalid tips? So during any homicide investigation, you have um information that comes in that is either sometimes very relevant, sometimes that isn't relevant.

Um, one of the big things in the beginning of any homicide investigation is to look at all of the um basically to look at an investigation without blinders, not to focus in on on one thing. Uh, as the investigation continues on, obviously your view of the investigation starts becoming a little bit clearer. Now there are times where um information that you are following up on becomes stale or is no longer needed and then you then go back and start looking at different avenues of release.

In this particular case, the information that we had and the investigation that we were following, the tips that came in that we did not believe to be or that I did not believe to be relevant were put to the side and we continued focusing in on the evidence and facts that we had at that point. >> So, were the tips what led you to investigating Aaliyah Botner? >> Yes. And do you uh recall receiving a tip regarding a possible hit on Caleb Flynn? >> I heard about um I believe I heard about that, but I did not follow up on that information. >> Was that Was there any other detective involved in the FBI who was reviewing the tips with you? >> Yes.

So there was a agent uh an Andrea Kenzik from the FBI and I believe that particular tip she was followed up on along with Air Force investigators >> and you did not personally follow up on that? >> I did not know >> did you were you responsible for reviewing that tip to determine whether or not that was relevant to the investigation or not? Your role was filtering the tips to decipher whether or not they were relevant to the investigation to continue pursuing.

Correct. >> That is correct. >> Were was that tip one of the ones that you personally filtered or did that go to a different detective? >> That went to a different detective. >> Um, regarding the camera that you uh reviewed that was across the street from in Vanilia. Uh, that you indicated that that camera is at the residence directly across the street. Correct. >> That is correct. Yes. >> And uh tell me, was that camera one that held cloud storage or had an SD card in it?

I >> I believe it was cloud storage. Uh the video that we watched with the homeowner was off his phone, so I would assume because it's Ring camera that it was cloud storage. >> And was it only recording when something was activated? And mean me meaning did it pick up movement and then begin recording? >> That's my understanding. Yes. >> Did you see or did you collect any video footage from that ring camera as far as anything that was recorded outside of movement being detected? >> Did you collect any storage outside of when movement was detected from the ring camera? >> I'm going to have tried the video that we collected.

We collected three videos. There were additional videos that the homeowner had that I did not collect. Does that answer your question? >> Yes, it does. >> Okay. Apologize. >> Did you uh ever do a search of 1518 Hurst? >> We did not. >> Did you ever do a search in the area surrounding 1518 Hurst? >> No, we did not. >> Did you ever conduct a search of Aaliyah Botner's vehicle? >> We did not. Not that I I did not. No. Did you conduct a uh search or did you uh can did you canvas the area around 1518 Hurst to see if there were any other camera any other cameras in any other houses around the area? >> Yes, I did. >> And did you find any other cameras that were outside of that residence? >> I did.

Uh one was the directly next door. I was spoke with that directly next door to 1521. That homeowner stated that they did have a camera, but that it was not recording. And we spoke to um another individual um just down the street that was not willing to provide us with that video. >> They were not willing to provide you with that video. >> That's correct. >> One moment, your honor. >> I have no other questions at this time.

Thank you, Detective Vargas. Uh he may also be released on some payments. >> Any redirect? There you are. >> Um, Detect Barkers, you may step down and you are released. >> Thank you, ma'am. >> Mr. Watkins, would you like to call your next witness? >> Yes, sir. State call Sarah uh special agent Sarah Dean of the FBI. >> Is it Reman? >> D E A N R N. >> Thank you. Special Agent Zebran, please come up to the witness stand over here.

When you turn, if you would raise your right hand, Miss Oendorf will swear you in. >> Mr. Watkins, would you like to inquire with this witness? Thank you, Ron. >> Could you please state your name and spell on the record? >> My name is Sarah Beverly. S A R A H D E A M R O N. And >> what do you do for a living? >> I am a special agent with the FBI. >> How long have you been employed by the FBI? >> Since 2015. >> What other law enforcement experience do you have? >> Prior to the FBI, I was with the United States Secret Service with the Uniform Division.

Uh, I became an officer in 2011. >> What training have you received as an FBI special agent? >> Graduated from Quantico in 2015 and have had subsequent training since then in various homicide evidence collection um, drug related investigations as well. >> How many homicide investigations have you participated in during your career? >> Approximately [snorts] 40 to include active and cold case homicide investigations. When did you first become involved in the investigation of Ashley Flynn's murder? >> February 17th of this year. >> Who contacted you to request FBI assistance? >> Captain Anthony Smith of the Tip City Police Department. >> In what location did you respond to on February 17th, 2026? >> The Tip City Police Department. >> Who briefed you when you arrived? >> When I arrived at the department, I met with Captain Smith and Detective Morgan.

They provided a briefing to us there at the city. And what information were you provided during that initial briefing? >> We provided everything that had occurred in the investigation up to that point. >> Did you then respond to the scene? >> I did. >> What did you obser observe when you arrived? >> When I arrived on scene, I observed that the scene was still secured. By that, I mean that there was police tape around the um residence.

There was an officer out front who was keeping a diligent log of individuals entering and exiting the residence. What did you do when you entered the scene? >> When I entered the scene, I first um kind of got a lay of the land. So, I walked in, observed to my left of the entryway, front entryway, a office that appeared to be a music room of some sorts, couch, and various music items. Directly in front of me was the living room.

Um, and then off to the left of the living room, the kitchen area and dining room. Off to the right of the entryway, directly back, was a um bathroom and then two what appeared to be children's bedrooms on either side of that bathroom. As I walk through the residence, um through the living room, through the kitchen, directly behind the kitchen was a laundry room. And on either side of the laundry room were a master bedroom, which had a master bathroom.

And then to the left was a hall up hallway that led to the garage. >> Then what did you observe of note in the garage? >> Well, as I walked down the hallway and entered into the garage, I observed a large garage door. There were two vehicles, a truck, and a minivan and then off to the left, a pedestrian exit door um that exited out into the lawn from the garage. >> Did you observe that door? >> I did. >> Can you describe the condition of that door when you first observed it?

When I first observed it, there was a large uh standing refrigerator that was slightly pushed off to the side. The door was open and the deadbolt to the door was in the unlocked position um in the door. >> What did you observe about any damage done to the area of the door? >> So, I continued to look at the frame itself. Um, when I first examined the door, um, I looked on the outside of the door because I've been told that there was a possible breaking and entering and I did not observe any damage to the outside door itself.

So, from the lawn entering into the garage, the only thing of note on the door was that the handle was not aixed to the door. So, there's no um prying marks. There were no um marks as though someone maybe had kicked it or rammed it with a shoulder, any other sort of blunt object. >> What did you observe about the door frame? At the point where the dead bolt was fixed. >> So when I looked at the door frame itself, several things stood out.

Um the strike plate that affixes to the door where the dead bolt would turn in was not a fixed to the door. I had later been informed by BCI and through photos that that had been discovered outside of the um residence on the ground near I think a trash can. Um but looking at the locking mechanism itself, there appeared to be what I would describe as gouge marks near the deadbolt um where the deadbolt would affix to the door.

Uh what was interesting about the marks um based off of my training and experience of observing doors that have been kicked in was the trim itself is was affixed with trim nails. And typically when a door is forced open the trim will be pushed in or separate slightly from the door. And in this instance, when I looked at the trim, there were gouge marks also on site on the trim. And the gouge marks were inside of the garage on the portion of the frame when in the garage when you would exit.

So they weren't on the outside portion of the door. So that stood out as significant to me. Also, what I noted um while looking at the frame uh at the garage floor inside of the garage, there appeared to be several wood chips that appeared as though they had come from the frame itself where the marks had been made. >> During your 15 years in law enforcement, how many doors have you observed that were forced or pried open? >> Approximately 75. >> And how was the damage you observed on Cunningham Court consistent with the doors you've seen that you know were pried or forced open?

It wasn't consistent in my opinion. >> Did you conduct a search of the exterior property and adjoining properties? >> I did. >> How was that search conducted? >> We conducted a grid pattern search of the backyard, standing shouldertoshoulder, walking together to ensure that we covered the entire backyard um to ensure there was no evidence that had been overlooked. Uh we also um searched the wood line um to the left of the residence and around and that was the extent of my searching outside. >> What did you locate of evidentary value during those searches? >> I located nothing outside of the residence. >> Did you interview Leah Botner on February 20th, 2026? >> I did. >> Who went with you to locate Miss Bner? >> Detective Zachary Farcus. >> And why were you looking for her?

We needed to conduct an interview with all potential witnesses involved in this case. >> Where did you locate her? >> At her mother's residence. >> Where was that? >> Curry Branch Drive. >> In what city? >> In Tip City. >> Who was with Aaliyah at her mother's residence? >> Uh, her mother was there. Also, several siblings were at the residence at the time that we entered. >> What did you and Tfo Farcus do after locating Aaliyah?

We asked if Aaliyah would join us um at the Tip City Police Department. She actually and her and her sibling um were driven to the Tip City Police Department for an interview. >> Who conducted the interview of Aliyah Bonner on February 20th? >> Myself and Detective Farcus. >> Where was the interview conducted? >> At the Tip City Police Department in one of their interview rooms. >> And who was present for that interview? >> Myself, Detective Farcus, and Aaliyah Bner.

Agent Deon, I'm now showing you what's been previously marked for identification purposes is states exhibit 277. You recognize this item? >> I do. >> What do you recognize? >> Uh Aliyah Botner's phone that we had taken from her on February 20th during the interview. >> And how do you know that? >> The packaging is familiar to me. >> And is the packaging in the same condition it was when it was packaged? >> Yes. >> Are all the seals intact?

Yes, the seals are intact. Please open. >> Do you recognize that item? >> I do. Would you recognize that item would be? >> Uh Ali Bondo, >> please place it back in the evidence bag for me, please. >> That phone's in the same condition it was when you collected it from Aaliyah on February 20th, 2026. >> Yes. >> Was Aaliyah truthful during your interview with her on February 20th, 2026? >> Alia originally was not truthful during the initial portion of our interview.

However, during the course of the interview, um Aaliyah did describe her relationship with Caleb Flynn. >> When did you conduct a second interview with Aaliyah Botner? >> On the 26th. >> Who was present during that second interview? >> Detective Farcus, myself, Aaliyah Botner, and her attorney. >> Where was that interview conducted? >> In the same room at the Tip City Police Department in one of their interview rooms. >> How would you compare her truthfulness during the second interview compared to the first?

Aaliyah was far more truthful um at that point in time. She came in and all questions she answered um right and without um us having to go back and ask additional questions. >> Was she more truthful about her relationship with Caleb Flynn during the interview on February 26, 2026? >> She was. Did you collect tools from 932 Cunningham Court on February 19th, 2026? >> I assisted Tip City Police with collecting tools. Yes. >> Who was present during that collection? >> Tip City officers. >> In what area of the home did you focus your tool collection? >> We focused our tool collection on the garage itself and then we also collected a few tools from the kitchen area. >> Approximately how many individual tools or tool items were collected? >> Approximately 70 or more. >> How many tools did you leave behind in the house?

To my knowledge, uh, we left no tools behind in the house. >> Can you describe the process you used to collect each tool? >> Each tool was collected in accordance with tip city evidence collection procedures and packaging. So, we collected each tool and um, with the exception of a few packaged them individually. >> And where were the tools eventually transported after collection? >> To tip city evidence. >> And after that, where did they go?

After that, we subsequently submitted them to the Quanico laboratory for examinations. >> That's the FBI laboratory in Quanico, Virginia. >> Correct. >> What type of examination did you request of those tools at the FBI lab? >> I requested paints and polymers in our chemistry department in Quanico. And I also requested firearms and tool markings, which examines all tool markings um of various evidence items. >> So, did you send the door and the door trim for analysis as well?

We did. How'd the door come back from Vonica? I drove out and collected the door and drove it back in a single day. Amen. >> Take that, please. Thank you. And I'm now showing you what's been previously marked for identification purposes is space exhibit 268. Tell me if you recognize that. This is a claw hammer that we collected from the garage um on the toolbench. >> You collected it from that address at 932 Cunningham Court. >> Yes, sir. >> That was submitted to labico. >> It was Did you receive results from the FBI laboratory regarding the door and Matt Hammer? >> Yes. >> How were those results communicated to you? >> They were communicated to me via email um and then subsequently added to the FBI file.

Do >> you remember when those results were received by you? >> I would have to review the document. >> What did you learn from those results? >> Objection, your honor. overruled. >> What did you learn from those results? >> We learned that um there were no paints. The paints and polymers unit did not identify any paint that was located on the tools. What they did identify was what they believed to be uh 1B evidence item 1B9 item 15 for their log was potentially the item that was used on the door to cause the markings.

And is that the item you have in front of you right now? >> It is. >> May I have a moment, your honor? >> You may. >> I have no further questions. >> Any cross-examination? >> Uh, yes. >> Mr. Mulligan, go ahead. >> Good morning. Um, the first day that you met with Aaliyah, am I correct that that was the 20th of February? >> Yes, sir. >> Okay. That's the first time you physically met her, >> correct? >> That's the day you took her from her mom's house to the police department. >> Yes, sir. >> Okay.

And you indicated that you took her there with her sister, but it's my understanding that the interview did not include sister Jessica. >> Correct. >> Okay. and you um showed us um exhibit 277 which was labeled as quote Aaliyah's phone. >> Yes sir. >> Um are you on that particular day did she identify any other phones that she had within the last couple of months? >> She had. >> Okay. And did she provide you with those telephone numbers?

I would have to go back and look at the report. >> Okay. Did she also identify you the quote unquote burner phone that she had? >> No. >> Okay. Um, tell the ladies and gentlemen of the jury what a burner phone is. a burner phone uh based off of my experience is a phone that's acquired um from a uh like a Walmart or any kind of convenience store in which you can activate the phone and have a additional phone. >> Okay.

And burner phones are many times used by um people the FBI have an interest in such as drug dealers. Correct. >> Correct. >> Because they like to transact their business on not their regular phone but rather a burner phone. Correct. >> And people who are trying to hide information typically have burner phones. Correct. >> Correct. >> So on the 20th, you indicated that she was quote unquote not truthful. What was the length of that interview? >> I believe the interview was approximately 2 and 1 half hours, but I would have to go back and look at the time. >> Okay.

And what is it that she was untruthful about? >> Uh, initially the relationship with K. >> Okay. Initially, what questions did you ask or Detective Farcus ask that you believe that she was not being truthful on >> originally? She denied having a relationship with Caleb. >> Any relationship? >> She denied having a sexual relationship or an intimate relationship with Caleb. How did she classify the relationship? >> Classified it in my opinion as a work >> sustained. >> At that point in time, did you already know that she was being untruthful to you? >> Yes. >> Okay.

And um you indicated that was one of the areas that she was untruthful. What else was she untruthful about? Can you explain >> what other topics >> what other topics was she untruthful about? >> Uh yes ma'am. >> The focus of our discussion was on her relationship with Caleb Flynn. >> Okay. And during the two and a half hours that you talked to her, did you how did how is it that you indicated to her that you just weren't believing her?

We had a text message that had been um acquired from um Ashley's cell phone that had indicated that there was not a that there was a contentious relationship between her and Ashley. >> Okay. And did she deny that as well? Um, as the interview progressed, she did open up about um, the text message and the source of contention between her and Ashley. However, she described their relationship as cordial. >> Okay. Did you know that was not the case? >> At that time, we were unsure of what the extent of their relationship was. >> Okay.

And how is it that you and Detective Farcus made the determination that hey this is uh this is just non-truthful information? >> We had completed an interview prior to that of a friend of Ashley's who had stated that she had confided in her about a potential um potential infidelity between Caleb and Ashley. >> And who was that friend if you recall? >> Um Miss Vargas. >> Magnus. Magnus, excuse me. >> I don't know that I'm pronouncing it correctly, but do you believe that's how you do it? >> Yes. >> Thank you. >> Now, you showed us um states exhibit number 268, which I think is still sitting in front of you, the hammer. >> Yes, sir. >> Can you u raise that up so we can see that?

Is there anything unusual at all about that uh hammer? [clears throat] >> Not of note, sir. >> Okay. And does the hammer itself identify where it was purchased from? In other words, who the manufacturer was? The only identifiers I of note are Master Force, >> Master Force, a brand name >> I assume. >> Okay. And um do in the report that you received from the analyst at uh at Quantico? Was there any determination as to how many of those hammers were manufactured in the United States? >> I would have to review the report.

Do you have that available? >> The I don't have I don't have the report in front of me. >> Okay. Um can she review that report? Let me ask you this. Would reviewing that report help you refresh your recollection >> and identifying how many hammers were created in the United States? >> Well, if that's in the report, I don't know. >> I would have to review the report to see if that was in there. >> Okay. Uh, can she be provided with her report to see if her recollection can be refreshed?

I have no question. I handed you the three-page report. Is that the report that you are referencing? >> No, it is not, sir. Okay. I have a two-page FBI lab report. Does that help you? >> This is a FBI lab report that was um provided by our um our laboratory in out of Huntsville. This is a report that's not um created by myself. I actually does it help refresh your recollection as to what you reviewed as to whether or not that hammer was similar to any [cough and clears throat] of the other [laughter] thousands, millions or whatever were made of that hammer.

No. So this is the chemistry Um this is from the chemistry lab paints and polymers not from the physical tool markings lab. >> You based on your um training and experience have reviewed uh lab reports in the past. Yes. >> Correct. >> And when a report comes back to you that is not exclusive such as the one that you reference saying that this is consistent. Tell the jury what that means. Can you repeat your question? >> Sure.

I'll I'll I'll rephrase it because it might have been um somewhat popular. >> The report that you got certainly didn't say that that was the particular hammer that damaged that door. >> No sir, because this is the painted polymer report. >> I'm not talking about that report. I'm talking about the one that you reviewed. >> If you have a copy of that, I'd be happy to review that. >> Uh I understand. Have you had a recollection of reading a report?

I don't have it right now. Um, do you had a recollection of a report indicating that this is consistent? >> Correct. >> That's not exclusive. You can't say that's the hammer that damaged the door. Nor can the investigator or the analyst at the FBI say that's the hammer that damaged the door. Correct. >> Correct. >> Okay. And further, that report did not indicate who operated the hammer. >> No, it did not. Okay. And that report does not indicate that that particular hammer is um different than any other hammer that's been manufactured in the United States, doesn't it? again.

So, are you speaking at the chemistry report? You >> not the chemistry report. Just that that particular hammer, there's nothing exclusive about it that separates it from any of the other millions of hammers in every garage in America. >> No, sir. >> No. Meaning you agree with me? >> I again would have to review the report. >> I don't have anything for this. Thank you, >> Mr. Watkins. Any redirect? >> No. I just move at this time to admit states exhibit uh 277. >> Any objection? >> Uh no. >> Court will admit states exhibit 277. >> Any furthering? >> Any further inquiry? >> Any recross as to that?

She may be released as well. Thank you. Um, ma'am, you can step down. You're excused. All right. At this time, it's almost quarter of 11. We're going to take our midm morning break, reconvene at 11:00 a.m. We're off. Uh, ladies and gentlemen, jury, um, during this recess, please do not discuss this matter amongst yourselves. Please do not let anyone discuss it in your presence. Please do not form any opinion with this this matter with with regard to until it's finally submitted to you.

Do not converse with the attorneys, the parties or the witnesses in this case as well as uh they cannot converse with you. If anyone should attempt to do so, please notify the court or my bail and we will address it promptly. All right, we're at the record until 11:00 a.m. All right, we're reconvening case number 26CR88, Sergio versus Kayla C. Flynn. We just took our midm morning break. It's currently 8 after 11 and we are proceeding with the state's case and chief.

Um, is the state ready to call their next witness? >> Yes, sir. >> Anything that we need to discuss before bringing the jury? >> No, your honor. >> Mr. Rollan, thank you. >> Miss Oendorf, please have the jury draw in. ladies and gentlemen, please have a seat. Welcome back. Please make sure your phones are turned off completely and then you give council and the next witness your undivided attention. At this point, Mr.

Watkins, would you like to call your next witness? >> State call Sarah. >> Miss Stel, would you like to come up to the witness stand? If you turn and raise your right hand, Mr. Oendorf will swear you in. Watkins, you may inquire with this witness. >> Thank you. Mayor, could you please state your full name and spell it for the record? >> My name is Sarah Stutel. S A R A H S S T U C H E L L. >> And where are you currently employed? >> I am currently employed at the Federal Bureau of Investigation or FBI in the laboratory division. >> What's your assignment within the laboratory division? >> I'm assigned to the firearms and tool marks unit in the laboratory division.

What's your title? >> My title is physical scientist forensic examiner. >> And what's your official duties as a forensic examiner? >> My official duties include receiving evidence, performing toolark examinations on that evidence, reporting on my findings, and testifying when called to do so. >> How long have you been been employed by the FBI? I joined the FBI in 2018 as an intern and have been officially employed as a full-time employee since the summer of 2019. >> How long have you been a Toolmark forensic examiner? >> I began my training program in September of 2021 and have been fully qualified since June of 2024. >> Could you please describe your previous experience in the FBI and how it relates to your current job as a toolar forensic examiner?

I first started as an evidence analyst in the evidence management unit. Uh in this position, I learned how to work within the lab under the quality system. I learned how evidence comes into the lab and how it is inventoried as well as how it moves throughout the lab for examination purposes. >> What's your educational background? >> I have a bachelor's of chemistry with a minor in forensic science from Washington and Jefferson College.

What training did you receive from the FBI to become a tool mark forensic examiner? >> I took a approximately 2 and 1/2 year training program. During this training program, I was issued a training manual which had a list of signoffs or tasks that taught me the knowledge, skills, and abilities that were required for my job duties. I was also assigned a training mentor who is a fully qualified forensic examiner that I worked alongside doing supervised case work with.

Where did you receive that training? >> The majority of the training was received at the laboratory in Huntsville, Alabama, with some parts of it being received at the laboratory in Quanico, Virginia. >> How are you tested in these specific disciplines in order to become a tool mark forensic examiner? >> Throughout the training program, I am issued a series of competency tests, which tests the knowledge, skills, and abilities that I need to perform for my job duties.

And at the end of the training program, I go through a series of oral boards which tests my technical knowledge as well as moot court exercises followed by a final qualification exam. >> Did you pass all those tests and qualification exam? >> Yes, I did. >> Have you taken a proficiency test? >> Yes, I have. >> How often as a toolar forensic examiner for the FBI, do you take a proficiency test? >> I'm proficiency tested annually.

What's the difference between a compet competency test and a [clears throat] proficiency test as it relates to teamworks? >> A competency test is designed by the unit and given to a trainee through the training program in order to test that that trainee has been acquiring the knowledge, skills, and abilities required for their job duties. Proficiency tests are given by an external test provider after an employee has been qualified in order to ensure that they are maintaining the competencies required of the job duties.

How do you stay current in your discipline? >> I'm required to take eight hours of continuing education per year and alongside that I also read articles as they are published within the discipline. >> How many samples have you examined over your career in the area of tool marks? >> I don't have an exact answer, but I would probably say around 2,000 samples. >> Does your laboratory have written protocols that govern toolmark examinations? >> Yes, they do. >> What's the purpose of those protocols?

The purpose of these protocols is to ensure that the examinations are being done in a way that follows the accreditation system and follows the quality assurance system of the laboratory. >> What is accreditation? >> Accreditation is when an independent third part third third party company comes in and analyzes the lab and all of the procedures and practices to ensure that we are working to the best of the quality system that we can. >> How is the [snorts] FBI lab accredited?

We're accredited by a company called the American National Standards Institute National Accreditation Board. >> Are tool marks themselves accredited? >> Yes, we are. >> Have you successfully completed all the requirements of the FBI to become a tool mark forensic exam? >> Yes, I have. >> And you've been qualified by the FDR to be a toolark forensic examiner? >> Yes, I have. >> Your honor, I move at this time uh to admit the witness as an expert tool mark forensic examiner. >> Any objections from defense?

No, thank you. >> The court will deem um Miss Sil Studel as an expert in two marking forensics examiner. >> How are tool marks used as part of forensic science? >> The discipline of tool mark identification is concerned with determining whether a tool mark was or was not produced by a particular tool. >> What is a tool? >> In the most general definition, a tool is anything that gives the user a mechanical advantage. So, if you think of trying to put a nail or a screw into the wall, you're going to use a hammer or a screwdriver to give you that mechanical advantage to make that task easier.

In the discipline, we define a tool as the harder of two objects. >> What's a tool mark? >> A tool mark is the reproduction of class and individual characteristics that occurs when a tool or harder object comes into forceful contact with a workpiece or a softer object. >> Can there be different types of tool marks? Yes, there are two different types of tomarks. >> Could you please explain the different types? >> The first type of tool mark are strided tool marks.

These occur when the tool is being pushed or pulled across the surface creating what looks like scratch marks. And the second type are impressed tool marks. These occur when the tool is being used in an approximate perpendicular motion or up and down to the working surface such as if you press a coin into silly putty. >> How is tool mark identification possible? Tool mark identification is possible because most manufacturing facilities are imparting rapidly changing or random microscopic imperfections or irregularities onto the working surfaces of common hand tools.

Those hand tools are then being further changed by use of useful corrosion such as rust once they leave the manufacturing facility. >> You mentioned characteristics. Could you explain what those are? Yes, there are a few different types of characteristics that I look for in my examinations. The first are class characteristics. These are measurable or discernable features of the specimen that result from design features such as the width of a screwdriver blade.

There are also individual characteristics which are random microscopic irregularities on that tool's working surface that occur incidental to the manufacturing process. >> Are there other types of characteristics you look for? Yes, there are. >> What are those? >> Those are called subclass characteristics. These are features that may be imparted onto items that are being fabricated by the same tool in the same approximate state of wear.

These are mostly seen you during manufacturing processes such as birching where a tool is scraping across multiple tools at the same time. So if there is a chip or a defect on that manufacturing tool, that could be imparted onto a series of those items. But if that chip then gets worn away or the blade gets replaced by the manufacturer, then that feature will not be present after a certain number of items. >> How do you tell if a subclass characteristic is present? >> Subclass characteristics typically express themselves as more gross.

And I say that relative to the microscopic individual characteristic. [cough and clears throat] Um, and they're typically only seen from certain types of manufacturing processes. So when looking at a tool and thinking of how that tool was made, that gives me an indication of when to look for subclass characteristics. >> Were subclass characteristics present in this case? >> A few of the tools I examined did have the possibility for subclass.

However, none of the question tool marks that I looked at had any subclass detected. >> Is there a certain methodology employed at the FBI? Yes, I use what's called the E3CV methodology which stands for evaluation, classification, comparison, conclusion, and verification. >> What is evaluation? >> Evaluation is the first step of the methodology. During this step, I am looking at the items of evidence to determine if they are suitable for a tomark examination.

An item suitable for a tomark examination if it has a visible tool mark or can produce a tool mark. >> What is classification? Classification is the level one analysis of the methodology. During this step, I am taking measurements and observations of the items and also looking at the value of microscopic marks. Meaning that I'm evaluating for the quality and quantity of individual characteristics that could be present for a comparison. >> What is comparison? >> Comparison is the first part of the level two analysis.

During this stage, I'm looking at two different items of evidence at once and comparing the individual characteristics, specifically their relative heights, widths, spatial arrangements, and curvatures to determine if there is a level of agreement needed for a conclusion. >> What is conclusion? >> Conclusion is the second part of the level two analysis. During the conclusion stage, I am looking for what is called sufficient agreement to determine whether the two marks are an identification or an inconclusive. >> What is sufficient agreement? >> Sufficient agreement is a threshold that I build during my training uh by looking at thousands of comparisons and I do this by looking at known matches which are tool marks that I know have been made by the same tool and no non-matches which are tool marks that I know have been made by different tools.

Sufficient agreement is met when two tool marks that I'm looking at exceed the level of agreement that I would expect to see between tool marks that I know have been made by different tools and is consistent with the level of agreement that I would expect to see between tool marks that I know have been made by the same tool. >> In your role, what type of conclusions are you able to make if needed? >> I'm able to render one of three conclusions.

An exclusion, an identification, or an inconclusive. >> What is exclusion? An exclusion can be rendered when there is a difference of class characteristics. >> How about identification? >> Identification can be rendered when there is agreement of all discernable class characteristics as well as sufficient agreement of individual characteristics. >> What is inconclusive? >> Inconclusive can be rendered when there is agreement of all discernable class characteristics, but there is neither agreement nor disagreement of individual characteristics to be able to render an identification.

Why would neither an agreement or disagreement of an individual charact [laughter] characteristic result in an inconclusive and not an exclusion? It is a policy within the FBI laboratory that we do not exclude based on individual characteristics because we acknowledge that tools may change. Whether that's through years of consistent use, abuse, or using the tool in a way that it's not supposed to be, corrosion such as rust, or by that tool being intentionally altered, such as grinding down the tip of a screwdriver. >> What is verification?

Verification occurs when a second qualified examiner is performing their own independent comparison and conclusion step of the methodology. >> Concerning the methodology, how are you how are the results of those techniques reported? >> They're reported in notes and as well as the laboratory report. Are there quality assurance measures in your division to ensure accurac to to ensure the accuracy of your reports? >> Yes, there are. >> Could you describe those for us, please? >> All of the notes and the laboratory reports go through both a technical and administrative review before they are released. >> What is a prying type tool? >> A prying type tool is a flatbladed tool that is used and makes a scraping or scratching type motion. that usually also employs a force to lever between two objects. >> Could you give examples of prime type tools? >> A few examples would be a screwdriver or a prow bar. >> What is a gripping type tool? >> A gripping type tool is a tool that has two opposing jaws that through force are able to place those jaws against an item to hold that item in place. >> Can you give us examples of gripping type tools?

An example of ripping type tools would be a wrench. >> What is a compressing type tool? >> A compressing type tool is a tool that uses force in an approximately perpendicular motion or up and down motion. And an example of this would be a hammer. >> What is a slicing type tool? >> A slicing type tool is a single-bladed tool that cuts in the direction that the tool is being used. For example, a box cutter. When you examine tool marks, what are you looking for? >> When I'm looking at tool marks, I am looking at class characteristics.

So any measurable or uh discernable features, including the action type, such as how was the tool used to create that tool mark. And I'm also looking at those individual microscopic irregularities of those foot marks. >> What equipment do you use to examine tool marks? >> I use two different microscopes to examine tool marks. I use a stereo microscope which is a lower level microscope that is used just to during the initial classification stage to get an overall view of what types of forms are present on the item.

And then I will also use a comparison microscope which is two microscopes connected by an optical bridge that allows me to look at two different items simultaneously. >> Did you use both of those microscopes in this examination? >> Yes, I did. >> What measurements did you take during your examination? I took measurements of various class characteristics. For example, the width of a screwdriver blade or the uh distance that a gripping tool opens up. >> What tools did you use to make those measurements? >> I used a caliper and also a stage micrometer that is mounted on the comparison microscope. >> What is a caliper?

A caliper? >> A caliper is a measurement tool. It has two jaws that will open that will allow you to place the jaws either around the item or within the item to get uh that measurement of that distance. >> What is a micrometer? >> A micrometer is an instrument that is mounted on the stage of the microscope. So when the stage moves, that micrometer will record the distance that the stage is moving to give what that measurement is. >> How do you ensure your measurement equipment is accurate?

The measurement equipment is serviced uh annually and the and they also performance checked. The calipers are performance checked twice a year and the stage mometer is performance checked day of use. And >> the tools you used in this case had those performance checks conducted on them? >> Yes, they did. >> And did they pass those performance checks? >> Yes, they did. >> How many crying type tools did you analyze in this case?

I don't remember the exact number of prime type tools, but I believe it was around 20. >> How about gripping type tools? >> I don't remember the exact number of gripping type tools, but I believe it was around 10 potentially >> and compression type tools approximately >> approximately two compressing type tools. As a tool mark forensic examiner, did you perform an examination or analysis as it pertains to this case? >> Yes, I did. >> And did the FBI laboratory receive items of evidence submitted from this FBI Cincinnati field office? >> Yes, it did. >> What is the procedure when evidence is received by the FBI laboratory? >> When evidence is received by the FBI laboratory, it will first go to the evidence management unit.

Within that unit, an evidence management unit personnel will take a detailed inventory of the items and they will enter those items into our laboratory information management system which gives the laboratory number as well as the item number of all of the items. >> Was the evidence in this case examined by any other units at the FBI lab? >> Some of the items in this case were also analyzed by the chemistry unit. >> Who looked at those items first? >> The chemistry unit.

Do you wear protective equipment when examining evidence? >> Yes, I do. >> What equipment do you wear? >> I wear gloves when I am examining evidence. >> And did you follow your unit's technical procedures when processing the evidence in this case? >> Yes, I did. >> Did you produce a laboratory report to record your findings? >> Yes, I did. >> What is an FTD worksheet? >> An FTD worksheet is the official form that is published by the FTD or the firearms homeworks discipline where I record all of my notes for my case.

Sean, you may >> Thank you. >> I'm now handing you previously marked for identification purposes as states exhibit 193. Do you recognize that? Yes, I do. >> How do you recognize it? >> Uh, this is the laboratory report that I