He Got An 8x ROAS On A Channel You're Spending $0 On transcript

the numbers for Q4 last year were insane we got a 8X return on that ad span we scaled that program up a lot this year we did not hit an 8X for Q2 but it's still uh much more profitable Raz wise than anything else we're doing marketer I barely know her what's up man how are you somebody I'm great somebody is going to be listening to this and or watching this and be like why did he just do that stupid joke and yeah to know why you got to go listen to Nate Lego's content and and watch's content that's why yeah that was yeah uh what's up man sorry everybody sorry that was a stupid I'm not sorry actually I got that I stole that from Nate go yeah if you think that was a bad joke that's my fault so I'll take the blame for that but uh Nate how's it going I um I I think you're awesome and you're Nate Legos and we are having this conversation because I think you are great and I think that you uh have things to say to marketers about how to grow their brands that are really different than so much of what gets shared in uh D Toc internet land whether that's Twitter or uh elsewhere and um and so you had you've come on before and we'll link that in the show notes everybody should go listen to and watch listen to and watch that hear about how Nate's got that dog in him um and uh and and and that that content that's actually a really well received episode people really liked that episode a lot um so it's time to have you back uh tell people a little bit about who you are I could give you a resume but tell people a little bit about who you are and what you're doing and um and why someone like me would have someone like you on the podcast yeah thank you man uh well I'm pumped to be back if anyone's listening that caught the first episode thanks for giving a lot of great compliments uh about it so I got the invite again but yeah I'm Nate Legos currently the uh VP of marketing for a regional grain watch company we make some of the most unique watches on the market um but I've been in Ecom uh for about a decade now I uh I started helping out Brands my freshman year in college when I realized that my marketing classes weren't going to teach me everything I needed to know in this industry um so worked for free for brands for a couple of years where while I was trying to Balance baseball and keeping my GPA above it too um did you was that successful were you able to do that most of the time yeah I think there's one semester out of one nine yeah uh that's fine we take the average take the Blended average it's like it's like was still higher than my ER so I was like I was pumped we're good it's like your Facebook like there's a couple bad dollars spent in there but as long as the number ends up in a good spot you're okay yeah yeah exactly exactly but uh yeah man we've uh we've had a lot of success in uh at origional grain the last couple of years um and so much of it has come from this stuff that isn't related to our Facebook ad account so that's what I'm really excited to talk about uh and yeah I just launched my podcast tactical and practical wherever you listen uh each episode I take One Singular tactic walk through it step by by step to show you uh exactly how you can implement it for your Ecom brand all geared towards adding uh bottom line at dollars yeah so uh that was really helpful to get people sense of kind of who you are the the your podcast is great people should absolutely go subscribe to it I don't know anything else quite like it um in e-commerce which is saying something because there are 4,000 e-commerce podcasts uh and many of them are very good um the vast majority of them are are interview shows like this one um it's part of why I do solo episodes a lot too is just to do something a little different uh but you know I ramble for like 30 to 40 minutes on a solo episode go on and on and on um and what your content is is first of all the the actual quality of the content is excellent It's also just like more structured and carefully put together and that helps you keep it under 15 minutes um I've got a fair amount of experience doing various kinds of public speaking and one of the things I've always discovered about that is that um to make your content shorter requires more not less prep it's much easier to go longer than shorter and what I can feel with your podcast is that you've carefully organized the information and presented it and it's extremely actionable like I'm thinking very much about how to apply some of the things you've talked about with my Brands and I thought like well this this is a great excuse for me to come and and ask you about some of that and and so um so anyway go check that out it is in the show notes it will really help you and it will not add very much time to your uh to your diet of DTC listening for the week because it it's uh it's it's relatively short to the point and again extremely actionable like you know on some stuff you were talking about the contract details of how how you worked out a contract with uh you know a YouTuber or a brand collab partner or whatever so um stuff that is really good so it's great dude um and and the original grain uh background is really helpful original grain's a really really cool brand um making watches um for men and suppose mostly for men uh out of uh out of all kinds of different uh materials like uh out of old guitars out of whiskey barrels out of all kinds of stuff and it's a it's just a really really cool brand and in the midst of that that has led to you doing a lot of stuff growth-wise so the big key here for this conversation is that we're not going to talk about meta ads very much at least I mean maybe maybe with reference but um what I'm fascinated by is your ability to grow a brand aside um and to do really well to do really awesome profitable brand growth that is not just about meta ad strategy and there's a convergence of two ideas in here that I think are crucial for people one of them is uh practically how do you actually execute profitable acquisition channels outside of meta uh and and Google or whatever right uh and uh and and really sort of outside of programmatic in general right outside of Google outside of snap outside of Tik Tok whatever how do you grow your brand with sort of you know different kinds of Partnerships and maybe with like a different kind of marketing um to do that and and to actually have it be profitable so much of what people talk about when they talk about um the idea of like growing other channels they're they're talking about it in a way where it's like well you know it's hard to pencil it out or whatever but you're like no it is super profitable for us and that's what we care about that's all we care about actually with these part ships is is driving brand value that's actually profitable so there's the there's the profitable growth outside of programmatic side and then on the other side there's also like how do I grow a brand like actually gr grow brand not just awareness but brand Equity make make make make my brand something that people love more and again A lot of times when people talk about branding they talk about the idea uh of branding as if it means burning money you know they'll talk about brand spend as a way of talking about like well you just what you got to do to and and I think that's wrong I've thought that's wrong but I've thought that's been wrong for a while or at least a stupid use of money uh for most brands in our space they need to see a return and your content and the stuff you've been talking about and what you guys have done in original grain it strikes me um threads the needle of those two things like very few others in this space and this is this part of why I think it's Unique content in our space it's really really cool so maybe maybe can we talk about first um maybe can you give us a sense of like what some of the better selling um products in your guys's collection have been as much as you're able to share about that so people can get a sense of kind of brand collabs and some of the stuff you guys have done and then we can use that as a jumping off point to sort of work backwards from there sure yeah our bestselling products or watches made from reclaimed whiskey barrel Woods guitar tone wood military ammo crates um and because we are able to use all these unique and reclaimed materials uh we've been able to partner with some incredible Brands um that we can kind of latch on to and immediately add decades or a century of heritage to what we are building um so our most re recent collab just came out with Jack Daniels um the biggest brands like I like I can't think of too many other brands bigger and more globally recognized than Jack yeah um so that's been huge for us we've also partnered with Taylor Guitars Bob Marley uh the New York Yankees a couple years ago what was the what was the product for that for the Yankees all uh watches made from original seats from like 19 whatever Stadium um yeah so Brands and you know organizations that on paper we kind of have no business partnering with um but because we're able to incorporate their history into Unique Products we can provide something that no one else really can um and it's been massive again both for sales and for brand building yeah so let's start there so how do you get conversations started with Brands like that a lot of emails a lot of LinkedIn DMS uh sometimes we'll send samples out if we can get an address for someone um we're fortunate enough now to be in year 11 of OG um we've done this before um so when we can send our Deck with Jack Daniels and the New York Yankees on it there's not too many brands that feel like they're bigger than that or better than that um so we've built up an impressive catalog at this point um but early on it was it was just a lot of grinding yeah it's like once you knock that first Domino down then the other ones are have a lot easier of a time right because yeah if if if you've had the Yankees involved then you can float that to Jack Daniels or Buffalo Trace or whoever you know it is that you've worked with and Taylor you know and yeah that makes sense um so um do you this maybe even more specifically one of the things I I think about your content and and the way you've unpacked some of these strategies is that it strikes me as something unique to original grain at least this is my first thought a little bit like you know you guys have it is it is the product that you're actually in incorporating wood from whiskey barrels from Jack Daniels that's that's unique and and so I was thinking like is Nate's Playbook here actually replicable um or is that because of what original grain is and so what do you think about that do you think let's start on the collaborator on the collaboration thing like do you think more Brands ought to be pursuing this kind of collaboration or is this unique to you guys I think other brands should be pursuing it with the asteris of you're you're going to going to be hard pressed to make it as cool as we can um you know I've worked with brands from Dugout mugs to Canada dips that um you know the product itself can't be too tailor made to fit a brand partner um but even if it's just an engraving even if it's just stamping their logo on it um tapping into these other brands that have way more brand Equity than you have um is massively impactful and often times it's something that that brand can get excited about um if you're a marketing director manager at one of these Legacy Brands there's not a lot of fun you get to have you got to stay within the brand guidelines there's never too much craziness going on so we've actually been able to get some amazing uh support from these Brands so no I I don't think it's just for us um I think you might have to work harder to make it work um if you're not you know as integrated as our collabs are um but I think it's an opportunity for a lot of Brands out there if you are still not using Billy for serers side tracking for your meta ads what are you doing my friends at Billy B ly. provide the best most upto-date and most cost effective most affordable serers side tracking tool for your meta ads what do I mean by that what I mean is replace your pixel with Billy use Billy for it instead is going to be 100% server side tracking you're going to have incredible event match quality you can just check it test it yourself s for $1 for the first month of Billy you can easily see how your event match quality will look with Billy relative to your original pixel I have done this with my clients I am either using it or testing it with every single one of my clients and uh it's been a great solution I pay the same amount you do by the way there's no special deal for me because they're an advertising partner my clients just like the tool they use it because they've seen better quality tracking for their Facebook ads by using Billy if you especially if you using the native Shopify integration for your Facebook ad tracking Billy is a no doubt upgrade to the quality and quantity of data that you are getting which will power meta ads with the best conversion tracking data possible to uh fuel machine learning and algorithms to work as best they possibly can and also report data as accurately as possible in your dashboard you will need a couple of more conversions per month maybe uh to pay for Billy it is that affordable and uh and everything about working with them is great super smooth and easy you will have it installed like in less than a minute on your website you can also use it for G for for Google ads for other channels as well and again the integration is insanely easy no developer required it's a couple clicks of a couple buttons and you're good to go go check out billy. a b y. a to get started with Billy today yeah I think so too I my my first thought was this might not be replicable and then my second thought was well why not like just be creative and think about like what can you do I was kind of going through my Rolodex of like brands that I either work with or have talked to a little bit and I just thought like even as simple as like an influencer collab a scent collab for some of the cpg brands I've worked with could you could you do something whether whether it's with an influencer or another brand where you do um where you sent but like if you think about this for your brand I bet there are ways that you could come up with some kind of co-branded product or whatever and basically pay the licensing and and ultimately at some point for the collab partner right there's there's going to be an element that once the deal is done they don't really have to do anything right like I mean like they it's just like licensing dollars for them and so they just get to sort of draft off of um you know the brand they've already built and just let it be some extra revenue for them you know do you think that's about right yeah exactly um a lot of these brands do have full-on licensing departments now um so it's something that they're used to and experienced in um but to your point it could be something as simple as a new flavor or color way just adding their logo to it if you're partnering with the right Brands they logo is going to be worth it enough um for you to see some serious brand lift and sales out of it yeah do you what can so just let's get a practical question here right away um can you give a sense of what kind of Licensing fees you guys are paying per product depending on the collab you know I don't know how how much information you could share here but um what should people be expecting to pay in royalties basically on uh per product yeah so all of our deals are structured uh with no money up front uh but a five to 12% royalty um depending on who we work with that's a big gap um we've seen you know seven and eight be pretty common um but some of these bigger brands that have earned it uh demand more that also comes with a minimum guarantee on the total amount of royalties will give them and a set term to the uh deal um so we'll have two years and we got to hit 100 Grand in royalties um we obvious ly weigh that do the math on our end um fortunately we've never come close to not hitting nmg um but yeah it's just a uh simple percentage on sales yeah that yeah that makes a lot of sense and and this is one of those places where like you know the ad account does actually kind of play in right because if you've committed to a minimum then clearly you know you know it's just like any inventory management there's like certain amount of stuff where it sort of come becomes that same thing where you just have to sell it you know and so um you basically have to allocate the spend and and and that's that um yeah is um do you have any sense of here's a question I've I've thought about with these kind of collab deals do you have any sense of the uh of the relative LTV of customers who come into your product on collab uh products versus on non- cab products and here's my hypothesis my hypothesis would be that your collab customers would be worse than your other customers because part of what is reflected here is that they're more loyal to to the other brand than yours and I'm just curious if that has played out it by the way if if so that doesn't mean it's not worth doing but I I just yeah so you're half right yeah um so we look at the brands we partner with kind of in two buckets the first is something that's already in line with something we do something that we know is going to crush like the guys have been making whiskey barrel watches for a decade so when we partnered with Buffalo Trace three years ago or Jack Daniels this year we already knew that was going work for for us there wasn't there wasn't a risk we were like hey this is going to crush we were pumped um that Customer because we have 30 of our own branded whiskey barrel watches and bracelets and accessories already that customer actually has a stronger LTV um the collab products are priced higher than any of our core products um so they are introduced to us through the brand that they're a fan of but then we have a whole catalog of products designed to sell to that person so their LTV is actually higher the other half of our collab partners are brands that are kind of outside the norm of what we do um things that we haven't done before that would be like Taylor Guitars and Bob Marley for us we had never worked with guitar wood we had never worked uh with hemp that we inlaid to the Bob Marley watches um we view those as kind of like a introduction uh to an audience that we're currently not hitting um so those deals um were introduced to a bunch of new customers we don't have a deep catalog of stuff that we know they will like um but we go into our next round of product development around that um so since we've uh launched with Taylor forish years ago we've actually gotten that cohorts LTV to be higher as well uh the Bob Marley cohorts currently lower we just launched with him in February um but yeah so it depends on the collab it depends on the rest of our kind of product catalog um but it's an important thing to know is like are we getting these guys once or we got are we you know getting this introduction that's going to bring more people to the OG tribe who are going to stay and buy again but that reflects to me more than anything else is just the importance of somebody the connection between like product and marketing uh and like being thoughtful about instead of just sort of like throwing it out there and hoping you'll get LTV right it's just like you're actually thinking about how to build for the specific customer you're thinking about like a Taylor Guitar customer is really different than a whiskey customer and so how do we do that you know I because I have a lot of church background I can tell you like Taylor is the guitar of choice for church worship leaders like it just and I bet you there is a uh I bet you I remember at some point I had heard that like Guitar Center it was like 25% of their sales or something like that maybe it was even more than that was sold was sold to like church musicians basically like it's like a it's a very large percentage of their business it's it's in terms of who's playing music it might have even been like 50% it's like it's a huge number um what that suggests to me though is like a a collab like Taylor appeals to somebody really different than uh a b Marley collab for example those you know those two despite both being ostensibly music collabs you know like it's just like a different set of things and so thinking carefully about who that customer is versus your Jack Daniels Customer because I bet your Jack Daniels customer is not your Marley customer necessarily either you know yeah um and so sort of pulling that together with uh with with product product development I think is is really helpful and thinking thinking about how you appeal to that customer do you think somebody should start this by thinking about who their current customer is or should they start it by thinking about opening up new customers I think you should start with your current customer base I think you should start with a collab on something that's very in line with what you do just adding more brand value to it adding a essentially a mega phone of a collaboration to it um that's a lot more likely to succeed I would hate for someone to start on something that's kind of out there have it flop and then say Oh collabs don't work for us yeah um I would definitely start kind of in in the lane of what your brand is known for that's what I assumed you'd say but just in case that ask um and then one other question about this I I I bet the answer is no but do you get any promotion to the Brand's audience at all as part of the deal like do they actually promote it occasionally uh so we always ask for the world we want to be included on their website and their email campaigns their social media we'll we'll ask for change the homepage yeah y um and at that point we're kind of just waiting for them to see what they're going to do um but we've had a lot of email inclusions a lot of collaborative social media posts a lot of wh listing uh to their uh account um all those have been really really powerful for us um we had a pre-launch to the Jack Daniels Tennessee Squires which is their like Insider members um the day before launch and um we couldn't believe how big and successful it was yeah that feels like that feels like that feels like a good it's a win for Jack Daniels too like that that's a really cool product to put in front of that group of super fans and I bet they're pretty happy to do that and they're going to make some money from it as well rather than just yeah and a category they're not currently selling to so yeah I I I totally get that um do um uh okay let's let's move over to YouTube Partnerships and some of those things you've talked about this you've said that partnering with YouTube creators on your ads has is the most profitable channel for original crane uh y uh that's that's wild why don't you do I mean people can go listen again we'll we'll put the link in there to to sort of your full breakdown of how you do this but that caught my attention like you you're seeing massive return on doing this so give us the the sort of intro first to kind of what that program looks like for you guys and and what it is that you're actually doing there sure we have focused uh our entire influencer program on YouTubers because I think it's a platform with the most attention and intention um there's two and a half billion people every month searching on YouTube for something very specific that they want to watch uh so because we know our customers so well we know that they watch videos of you know bourbon cocktail recipes on YouTube and they'll watch a guy open the newest bottle from Jack Daniels and drink it and review it um we reach out to all those creators tell them that we would love to uh sponsor usually a series of videos two or three or four um especially as we approach big promotional periods for us like valtin WN day Father's Day or Christmas uh agree on a flat fee uh to sponsor those videos send them some product give them some loose talking points um we give them their own discount code and uh link with a UTM on it uh to promote to Their audience um and yeah the numbers for Q4 last year were insane we got a adx return on that ad spend um we scaled that program up a lot this year we did not hit an 8X for Q2 uh but it's still uh much more profitable row as wise um than anything else we're doing okay so there's so many questions here that I could ask uh let's start with um scaling it up so this this is manual Outreach to creators right there's you're not using software you're just finding channels searching YouTube that kind of thing yeah we have tried uh and eventually quit kind of every like influencer scraping tool out there um we found them to be more troubled then their Worth or they make a Creator like sign in and create an account and it just never goes anywhere so we haven't found a better system than manual YouTube search um it lets you search by keyword of the channel title and uh of what content is in there then we typically find an Instagram page that's associated with that YouTube channel hit them up there or we'll find an email and send them an email um but that is the only downside to this program um it just takes men hours uh to be able to scale it up do you how many people do you currently have employed for whom this is a large part or full-time part of their job uh one okay so is there enough juice there to squeeze to where you could employ four you know eventually um the only reason I say eventually we'd want to do it more kind of slow and steady than that um we are currently looking for a way to expand that um because so much of the process is kind of the outre the research and then the Outreach um there's not a ton of skill in the research um especially if someone could present us with a list of like hey here are the channels here are their average views for the last month or last 10 videos um we think we can get a VA um to do a lot of that so um if there room to scale it yes we we used have a very slow and steady approach uh to everything so we're going to do it step by step uh okay you are uh you specifically said you're doing I think between two and four I love to see the Red Bull happening live that's part of the Nate Legos brand Red Bull hat nowcast crushing yeah got crushing you you need to get that should be your next I know you you've got a you've got a SAS sponsor right now on your podcast you should see if you get Red Bull involved do that c the Nate leg I would love to I don't know if they pay for it though I'm already giving them several areas of free exposure during the show it's such a baseball Community thing with your baseball background to just be crushing energy drinks for sure yeah that was just Summer Ball was crushed two in the bullpen before I came in to P the N so good um so uh anyway no so you said uh between two and four um so do you uh why uh why not uh do one save the money research it see if one of them works and then scale it up from there the reason we don't do one uh is because our aov is 300 bucks um typically something that people need to see a couple times before they're convinced typically something that people might have to save up for um when you look at our customer base uh we're unique in that the buyer is not the guy who wears it uh the buyer is typically that guy's wife girlfriend mom daughter um so you know that men and women in relationships don't always have great communication so we need some time to happen and we need her to ask him what do you want for your birthday or Christmas and he'll say I don't know for two weeks before he finally says oh well I saw this thing it's kind of cool um so for our brand in particular um I think we need more than one ad um and we've seen two three and four work really well we've also seen five six seven and eight start to fatigue if they happen this is this was going to be my next question yeah if they happen too quickly what happens if you spread them out um we uh we do um but you know even if you do four weekly leading up to a holiday sales period like that's probably the most you can do um unless we want to start our Father's Day sale in April which I'm not really against I would do that but buyer Behavior just doesn't start thinking about these holidays until you know 30 to 45 days out um so that's that's why we're limited there yeah makes sense okay and this you know you mentioned the gift thing this is something I've wondered about with this because there's a lot of Brands out there that are selling gift products and uh and I've I've worked with a lot of brands that have sold them and I've always thought about this uh this element that when you're selling gift products um one of the mistakes people make is that they think oh because the gift is for somebody else um I have to think about the other person but I think one of the fundamental things selling gift products is is that there is something in it for the Gift Giver um and the thing that's in it for the Gift Giver is the pleasure and joy of giving a good thoughtful gift that they feel great about I know this in part because I'm a bad Gift Giver and anytime I come across something my wife's birthday's coming up I found an awesome gift this year and I'm taking her to an awesome place and both are thoughtful and the place that I'm taking her to has a unique thing that she will love on her birthday um huge and let's go so I am like thrilled about this because I suck at giving gifts and and so I am already excited to give her those gifts which means there's something in it for me right yeah um and and so so anyway so the reason I bring that up is because have you guys partnered with YouTube channels that are targeting The Gift Giver really specifically and not the gift receiver like why why trying to do this this would be very hard I think actually it would be a a broader net to cast in some ways uh in a way that the audience is less tight and I assume that the sort of tightness of the audience is part of what makes YouTu work for you but I um I'm I'm curious if you've tried that yeah so you're absolutely right when we are selling to the guys who wear our watches we want to sell confidence and status and we want you know uh they are buying this watch for themselves um because they want their tribe family friends to recognize them as oh he's the bourbon afficionado of the group for sure that's who he is dude that's can I just pause really fast that's yeah so insight that like you're not selling a watch you're selling my sense of being a bourban officient Auto like that is a really really helpful thought to think about for people's businesses for what marketing is in terms of tapping into aemotion we uh we worked with Sarah levinger like a year and a half ago um because up until that point I thought I was selling watches um and I'm not um and I think that something that marketers especially all of us in Ecom kind of grew up in the direct response world like we think we're creating demand for our product and it's like no no no the demand already exists inside the human psyche like men have wanted to feel confident and important and looked up to for however long you think humans have been around so all my marketing is trying to do is play into that and say hey I have a product that can let you feel all those things yeah yeah that's really cool I'll link Sarah's a great follow on Twitter I will link her her uh her in the in the uh notes for this as well so go go check that out and give her a follow so when we're selling to the women we're not selling status or confidence we are selling like you said the ability to nurture their partner um so we uh have sponsored a handful of female family focused creators um most of them are wives and mothers um the whole mom Vlog lifestyle kind of chicks um we have a way of measuring how much each Creator's audience is worth to us uh so it's the opposite of CPM we measure RPM Revenue per thousand views um and we see that those female Focus creators are worth slightly less to us um than you know the most Niche whiskey guys uh but it's still well worth it to us and we just know that going into these deals now um so we know that we pay a lower fee on it um but yeah marketing to both the Gift Giver and the gift receiver um has been really important and um I love seeing comments on our Facebook ads of being like me and my husband have been seeing these ads on YouTube Y and it's like I know you're not watching the same Chan right um but it's cool that we're kind of casting that widenet yeah do um uh okay so actually tell me more about YouTube specifically and why Why YouTube you mentioned this a little bit but um I mentioned tightness of the audience and and look like what I know about my own audience like I sell ads here I'm going to put an ad insert an ad into this episode about how working with more Staffing my my Filipino staffing agency sponsor is like the perfect way to go staff up your ability to generate the kinds of Partnerships that you and I are talking about on this um and the reason I know that will appeal to my um clients first of all because clients excuse me my is because it's true first of all um and I I will represent it authentically uh because I actually believe that and so that's why I've worked with them for a long time I'm really happy to send people to them um but then secondly because my audience is not that big but it's really tight it's it is like the only person listening to or watching this content is somebody who is a DDC professional they have not made it 32 minutes into this um to get to the reference to Nate's baseball career that we just had a second ago right that's not what they're here for um as much is like we probably could lay down a long episode about about that um my dad would be pumped about it yeah yeah yeah right um but the um the yeah so that's my that's my sense of what makes YouTube good um is that right and what am I missing why else is YouTube so valuable yeah so it's the second biggest search engine in the world second only to Google um so there's so many people going here looking for something specific um and I think you would agree on meta uh your ad creative does the targeting for you right the content of a YouTube video does all the targeting you need yep I do not ask creators for demographic info I do not ask them if it's a male dominated audience yeah you know that from looking at the what country they're in if it's a 19 minute long video where these guys open six bottles of whiskey and drink them and review them I know exactly who's watching that um so let the content do the targeting for you the more Niche the audience or the more Niche the topic uh and how closely related that Niche is to the products you can sell um the audience is going to be more and more valuable so in scaling this program up we have sponsored shows that are much less targeted and more kind of broad lifestyle some comedy podcasts those audiences as we know we cannot pay the same price for as our super Niche creators um because even though the audience size might be bigger um the the interest isn't as heavily stacked in our favor yeah and I think this is so crucial this is you know I always I think back always to when I was at Kao um silicone wedding rings and still one of the most effective marketing campaigns I've seen is when Kayla wanted to break into CrossFit and what we did was we we targeted uh I've talked about this a lot of times but I still think it's a really good example we targeted um every possible engagement with the CrossFit Community we could we were working with Crossfit Charities we were at the CrossFit Games we were at the CrossFit Regional games you know the smaller events leading up to it we were working with Crossfit influencers we we sponsored the CrossFit games like we and then we were advertising with content with Crossfit style content on uh our uh on our you on our Facebook ads as well so there people were scrolling they were also seeing those those things and it feels to me like YouTube is just such a place where if you have any niches at all to your product if you are there then it's just so perfect because you can go find people yeah who like you said that the creative does the targeting for you right in that same thing as part of that do you guys uh at original like when you guys build these deals do you do any sort of add-ons to the deals where you know you use their other social channels or you get access to the ad to the ad reads for their ad content um you know do you do do you sort of add anything else like that to uh uh to to the deal as part of it and if so is it successful we try to but it's rare um a lot of creators I think have wised up to it um and know that they should be charging money for whitelisting Access and they should be charging more money um to use the you know video content in our meta ads um so it's something we ask for um a lot of creators are trying to charge a lot of money for it these days we pass a lot um but the few times we've done it it's worked pretty well yeah my my older brother um I'll link this too in the show notes for anybody who who is interested in this my old brother is a YouTuber uh as well as actually does video production and his um his uh YouTube channel is called Mort garage it's all uh V retro video games is his is his audience so he's like a a vintage retro video game collector um he has 3,000 video games U and uh and so his whole channel is about like game collection and and he goes to a lot of like swap meets and buys and sells and he just kind of Chronicles all of it so really tight audience right if you if original grain had a video game related product right he would be like got no brainer for this but part of what he started to do that's interesting to me is um uh because he's talked to me about it is he'll spin out he'll create the ad and then he'll spin out a vertical version of the video as well and try to upsell it back to the to the brand partner so nice um so they can actually have it pre-edited uh and used for for uh for meta ads in vertical format you know and and I think it's I think it's really smart and I think more creators hopefully will get WIS to this because they're already making the ad and they're already making the edit like they're already in YouTube somewhere making the edit so it's it's a it's a small thing for him he just like makes sure to shoot it in a way that's pretty easy to make the edit can pass that along and charge an extra 500 or, bucks or whatever for the episode you know I don't remember what he's charging but um yeah that's smart something like that yeah so you you have found that content has worked well in the out account when you've used it on some occasions yeah um again it's uh that's the only way it gets a little bit difficult with how Nisha Creator is because they might be heroes to their small audience but then running them to abroad and Target it all it's actually going to be about the quality at that point yeah like it's more about how passionately they sell it how much does that guy look like a representation of who our customers are um so it's worked it at times it's not always a slim though I mentioned it in this episode with Nate and I'm serious if you're considering scaling up your marketing team you absolutely should be considering doing it with incredibly talented marketers from the Philippines via my friends at more Staffing the fundamental mistake of thinking about overseas hiring is thinking that the only thing you can find overseas is extremely entrylevel employees doing repetitive and simple tasks that is wrong that is wrong and there's really no reason for you to think that by working with my friends at more Staffing you can find incredibly talented people with DPC Commerce resumés in all parts of your business including marketing but also supply chain operations Etc and you'll find people who really know their stuff bring a ton to your team and are really part of your team and that you can do that while paying talented people at high rates in the Philippines that is going to attract really high quality talent and at the same time it be less than you would pay for equivalent Talent significantly less than you'd pay equivalent talent in the US it is a winwin you attract great people they make great money you also keep your Opex nice and lean go to more now.co I have staffed up my own team I'm adding at least one maybe two or three more people to my team from more Staffing I have never once gotten rid of somebody from my team uh that more Staffing is placed with it I have loved every hire that I've had so uh you should go do the same thing more now.co build your team in the Philippines incredibly talented people today at Nate Legos on Twitter tactical and practical wherever you listen to podcasts and uh yeah appreciate Andrew you have me back on it's been great man thanks so much for watching or listening to this episode wherever you are watching or listening to it I appreciate it so much if you loved it subscribe and also share with a friend that's the number one way you can say thanks to me uh don't forget to go follow up with my friends at Billy b. for service side track for your meta ads and more Staffing by going to more now.co F to get incredible Talent from the Philippines in your e-commerce business and follow up with Nate you will love his podcast if you like this interview if you made it this far you'll definitely love it go do that follow out in the show notes and of course you can also listen to my old episode with Nate which is also in the show notes uh thanks again I will see you next time [Music]